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Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease--- Testimonial.

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Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease

Posted by Line on February 20, 2001 at 20:47:18:

My husband, poor thing, has arthritis of the spine and what they call "mixed (or multiple) connective tissue disease". He actually gets along remarkably well, although something is always bothering him - pain somewhere, reynaud's, hiccups, reflux, now dizziness. Any idea what could be causing the dizziness? It comes and goes, sitting or standing, and seems to be better after he swims, which is the only exercise he can do. Also, have any of you helpful people out there ever heard of anyone else who has these two diseases? I'm sure it must be rare. Supposedly they are unrelated. What do you think?



Re: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease

Posted by Sean on February 20, 2001 at 21:39:07:

In Reply to: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease posted by Line on February 20, 2001 at 20:47:18:

Line,

Someone posted this link a couple weeks back.
http://drmirkin.com/joints/J103.htm

Nice short article. The main gist of the article is suggesting that the AS may be caused by a causitive agent perhaps from bad food or an infection and that perhaps even your diet may play a role in the disease process staying.

I have a friend that had AS he took the drugs his doctor gave him (mostly just strong anti-inflammitories - btw dont take these on a empty stomach; he did and it was very painful for him).
Anyways ... From what I gathered my friend took fish oil, and vitamins and glucosamine and condrotin for his condition. I cant remember how long he had it, but his doc says its now in remission. I tried to get my friend to look at other parts of his diet but well you know ho friends can be sometimes.

I would also suggest you look at some of the archieves on this BB. There were some good articles that someone else wrote here about their fight with arthritis (forgot which one) that still may pertain to your husbands condition.
I think they were Bob's articles hmm cant remember thou.
He was writing a book.

Sean




Arthritis is caused by LGS (chronic bracing)

Posted by Rich on February 20, 2001 at 22:21:52:

In Reply to: Re: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease posted by Sean on February 20, 2001 at 21:39:07:

Your husband is suffering the effects of Leaky Gut Syndrome caused by chronic bracing. The dizziness is autointoxificaiton and will improve once he treats the cause and the symptoms. LGS causes deposits of toxins the joints and leads to this condition.

He needs to treat dysbiosis (bad bacteria gaining a foothold in the intestinal tract), eliminate food sensitivities caused by the LGS (this will improve dizziness), improve digestion with plant enzymes and HCL, and most importantly, begin the healing process of the LGS by practicing SR twice a day.

There is lots more that can be done and I can help you with that. First, look up some of these terms in the glossery and archives and do a little research on LGS. Then, come back here if you still have questions.

Rich



What about juvenile rheumatoid arthritis?

Posted by Jenna on February 21, 2001 at 17:34:32:

In Reply to: Arthritis is caused by LGS (chronic bracing) posted by Rich on February 20, 2001 at 22:21:52:

Same cause? Sounds far-fetched to me!



Re: What about juvenile rheumatoid arthritis?

Posted by Rich on February 22, 2001 at 00:01:56:

In Reply to: What about juvenile rheumatoid arthritis? posted by Jenna on February 21, 2001 at 17:34:32:

Jenna, LGS still plays a role. Some people are born with LGS. LGS can cause all sorts of immune malfunctions that lead to arthritis at any age. From reading posts that you have written on this board, it seems to me that you are not impressed by anything here. I am wondering why you continue to post. Maybe you aren't exactly sure what to believe. ??

RIch



Re: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease

Posted by Walt Stoll on February 22, 2001 at 09:52:40:

In Reply to: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease posted by Line on February 20, 2001 at 20:47:18:

Hi, Line.

Listen to all the others who have responded. You must be new to the BB since we have discussed how all chronic connective tissue disorders are related for years.

Welcome to the BB.

Once you have used the archives, if you still have questions, write again.

Walt

Follow Ups:


Re: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease

Posted by David on February 22, 2001 at 10:20:10:

In Reply to: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease posted by Line on February 20, 2001 at 20:47:18:

Dr. Milne Ongley can fix your husband's joints with reconstructive ligament therapy. I am quite confident that if your husband can spend two or three months, and about $20,000-$30,000 at Ongley's clinic in Ensenada, Baja California, that he will come back feeling much, much better. The only question in my mind, is "How long will the relief last?" That depends very much on the individual and the root cause of the condition. Ongley seems to be very successful in treating Ankylosing Spondylitis. Many patients get very long term relief, and for others the relief last a few months. Do visit Ongley's web site, linked below, and check out the notes posted by Ongley's patients.

I will mention one patient history with which I am familiar. A man about 70 years old had Lyme disease for 10 years. Despite the fact that he had a tick bite with the classic bull's-eye red spot reaction, no doctor could even properly diagnose the Lyme disease. He was treated with all kinds of anti-biotics which, he says, destroyed his immune system. Finally he went to the Century Wellness Center in Reno, Nevada--a homeopathic clinic. He says that they diagnosed his Lyme disease by looking at his blood under a microscope, and that they cured his Lyme disease by boosting his immune system. After this, he went to see Dr. Ongley to get his joints fixed. He came in depending on a walker, and walked out on his own two feet. While at Ongley's clinic, he also underwent chelation therapy and intravenous ozone treatment. At the end of his stay, he told me that his blood pressure was normal and his PSA count was zero.

A year later, I heard that he had a recurrence of the Lyme disease and had gone back to the Century Wellness Center. But I am sure that he remains very grateful to both the Century Wellness Center and to Dr. Milne Ongley.



I find the concept of LGS hard to fathom

Posted by Jenna on February 22, 2001 at 17:32:58:

In Reply to: Re: What about juvenile rheumatoid arthritis? posted by Rich on February 22, 2001 at 00:01:56:

Other ideas I like.

Maybe it would suit you if I would just leave but I'd prefer to stay. Thank you!



Good idea but probably bad timing

Posted by Rich on February 22, 2001 at 17:40:16:

In Reply to: Re: Ankylosing Spondylitis and Connective Tissue Disease posted by David on February 22, 2001 at 10:20:10:

I am very familiar with prolotherapy having received it myself for over a year. Initially, it was great but after 3 months of stopping, it all came back. Now, I know why. This was due to not stopping the Leaky Gut Syndrome involved in arthritis. Without stopping this, the problem will most certainly return. I think the key here, is to stop the LGS, gain as much benefit from diet and supplement as possible, and THEN treat any lingering pain or weakness with prolo. You will spend less money because you will get well quicker, and the results will most likely be permanent. Dr. Ongley also happens to be one of the most expensive prolotherapists in the country. Dr. Hauser in chicago, who is equally as good, could probably get the same job done for about $10,000 or less.

Rich

Follow Ups:


I will not debate you Jenna.

Posted by Rich on February 22, 2001 at 17:50:24:

In Reply to: I find the concept of LGS hard to fathom posted by Jenna on February 22, 2001 at 17:32:58:

Jenna, why are you so angry? I have come across many posts written by you and many people who clearly feel the same way as I am starting to. If you don't believe in the concept, why are you here? What do you gain from this? 70% of the world probably sufferes from some degree of LGS and yes, you can be born with it. With new testing (Intestinal Permeability Essay for one), these numbers are starting to make sense. Great Smokies says that 1 out of every 2-3 people they test, has some degree of LGS. Now, this is coming right from the source of the testing. I would like not to believe it too but it's right here in front of us.

Also, I have virtually solved my own health issues and I am 85% better. Time will take care of the other 15%. This is all based on my own research for that past 5 years and getting ideas from other pioneers in the field of alternative medicine. You seem so confident that what I and others are saying can't be true. I am wondering what basis or what facts you have to back this up. honestly, though, I would rather not hear about it. I would normally not mind getting into a friendly debate over a topic such as this but I see the way you start attacking people's positions from the slew of posts I have read. I will not get drawn into a debate if that is what you would like. I would be happy to discuss the issue with you but not in the context of your other posts.

Rich



Great Smokies is a "dubious" lab

Posted by Jenna on February 23, 2001 at 18:21:57:

In Reply to: I will not debate you Jenna. posted by Rich on February 22, 2001 at 17:50:24:

Who would believe anything coming from that lab? Rich, your best bet in the WORLD would be to not debate with me at all.

LGS is also a very "dubious" concept. What proof do you have of it?

With my theories, I have proof to back it up. Where's yours?

You should research that Quackwatch site you gave to me...Great Smokies is in there darlin'.



Good old Jenna acting like her good-old self!

Posted by Rich on February 23, 2001 at 20:42:57:

In Reply to: Great Smokies is a "dubious" lab posted by Jenna on February 23, 2001 at 18:21:57:

has anyone ever told you that you are very sarcastic? No need to be but do what suits you.

Chiropractic care is also listed in quackwatch so what's your point? It is well recognized that chiropractors relieve back pain better than doctors. This is proven beyond a shadow of a doubt. I wouldn't trust the info in quackwatch. They are quacks themselves. They are completely anti-alternative. They ridicule chiropractic because one girl got hurt like 10 years ago but they say nothing about conventional doctors killing thousands of people a year because of side-effects from drugs. You wanna debate me? go right ahead!!

You want proof? there is plenty of it. You try telling the hundreds of health professionals that have treated their patients for LGS and succeeded that they are wrong. You can't tell me, having achieved an 85% reduction in symptoms, that LGS doesn't exist. i got better because I was smart about what the cause is. what I and others say about LGS causing disease makes sense. What do you think it is?

I am going to let you in on a little secret that most everyone here already knows by now....Fibromyalgia, CFS, arthritis, IBS, crohns disease, Colitis, Lupus, AS, MS, are virtually THE SAME DISEASE!!! They are all have their root in LGS.

I have results to back up my claims, what do you have Jenna?

Did you even bother reading the tons of posts last week and the week before from people telling you to basically get lost? You know why they did that? Becuase you are very rude. You also make no sense. Here you are, someone that doesn't believe in the basic concept of this board and here you are floating around on it bashing people. I think you have fun doing this.

Oh yeah, what THEORIES do you have Jenna? What you are trying to do is re-invent the wheel and I don't think you are that smart

Rich :(



Quackwatch is a Joke...no msg

Posted by exasperated on February 24, 2001 at 11:44:35:

In Reply to: Great Smokies is a "dubious" lab posted by Jenna on February 23, 2001 at 18:21:57:




Indeed it is. If conventional medicine was scrutinized as closely as holistic medicine, there wouldn't be one conventional treatment that was NOT on the quack list!!! NMI

Posted by Rich on February 24, 2001 at 11:53:28:

In Reply to: Quackwatch is a Joke...no msg posted by exasperated on February 24, 2001 at 11:44:35:

nmi



I'll be back with more for you...right now I'm going to lunch!

Posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 15:10:03:

In Reply to: Indeed it is. If conventional medicine was scrutinized as closely as holistic medicine, there wouldn't be one conventional treatment that was NOT on the quack list!!! NMI posted by Rich on February 24, 2001 at 11:53:28:

Here's one interesting article for you


http://familyinternet.com/quackwatch/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/candida.html


Dr. Stoll's candiasis theory is shot to bits...I have some studying to do on LGS but I'll GUARANTEE to you that I'll have some lively discussion for you on that, too.

Yes, I am sarcastic Richie-poo. I like it like that.



They have no proof that treatments for LGS work!

Posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 15:12:51:

In Reply to: Good old Jenna acting like her good-old self! posted by Rich on February 23, 2001 at 20:42:57:

No studies!! LOL Hundreds of doctors?? LOLOLOL You say that like it's a big number! WOW I'm impressed! LMAO LOLOLOLOL



Does this BB have a board monitor?

Posted by lauri on February 24, 2001 at 17:09:45:

In Reply to: They have no proof that treatments for LGS work! posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 15:12:51:

I ask this because, while not wanting to encourage cutting
off freedom of speech, it's nice to have some guidelines
regarding behavior(if you do this already Dr. Stoll, then
thank you).

I've seen some pretty exciting/heated debates on this site
that, for the most part resolve themselves to the
positive-great for all involved and nothing is wrong with
passion for a subject or a belief. But geez, when it seems
that a person is entertaining themselves with name calling
and combative behavior with no apparent positive goal in
mind, shouldn't something be done, like a warning to behave
or something?

There are many ill people who come to this site for help.
We bring our grumpiness with us sometimes, because we feel
sick. We're desperate, tired, frustrated, medically
uneducated, impatient, betrayed by MD's, you name it, some
of us are dying faster than we would choose. Dr. Stoll and
many others here are quite understanding, patient,
empathetic and more when the words get heated...

I was frequenting a health BB site quite a while ago, that
drew lines when the conversations ceased to be helpful, and
began to be harmful, and negative. Dr. Stoll, at what point
do you believe it's appropriate to let someone know to tone
down the attitude or leave (or be kicked off)? It IS
possible to state your frustrations, or your disagreements
without getting personal-like use some self control and
discipline-skills sorely needed to fight LGS, follow diets,
and heal yourself. It's like practicing what we preach. If
it was easy to ignore the negative posts of certain persons
I suppose we would, but I think many of us are concerned we
may miss valuable information hidden amidst the vitriol. It
can be a drag.

It takes courage to say 'sorry', but I've seen it happen on
this board when misunderstandings occur and personal remarks
are made. It's an honor to be allowed to communicate on
this site, and access should be respected. At leas



oops!

Posted by lauri on February 24, 2001 at 17:17:06:

In Reply to: Does this BB have a board monitor? posted by lauri on February 24, 2001 at 17:09:45:

...At least that's how I feel. Lauri (That was the last
sentence on the above post by me. Sorry! I must have
rambled way too long

Follow Ups:


Re: I'll be back with more for you...right now I'm going to lunch!

Posted by B.B. on February 24, 2001 at 17:28:26:

In Reply to: I'll be back with more for you...right now I'm going to lunch! posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 15:10:03:


Jenna,

Your defense comes from Quackwatch is the best you can do? I'd like to see some facts other than anything from quackwatch.



You wanted it...you got it.

Posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:21:46:

In Reply to: Re: I'll be back with more for you...right now I'm going to lunch! posted by B.B. on February 24, 2001 at 17:28:26:

I'll be back with more...and more...and more....

http://www.wellweb.com/nutri/questionable_diet_and_nutrition_.htm



Here's a REALLY good exerpt about why STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are good proof! :)

Posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:53:08:

In Reply to: Re: I'll be back with more for you...right now I'm going to lunch! posted by B.B. on February 24, 2001 at 17:28:26:

http://www.naturalhealthvillage.com/reports/council_of_sci_affairs.ht

That is where I got this from. Interesting reading, I must say...

"Buckman30 points out that the success for many of the therapies being embraced by the public may be explained in several ways. The "cures" may have come from misdiagnosis, and when the anecdotes of healing are traced to the original sources, no data can be found. Patients may not have had the diagnosis for which they were "cured" or the data may have been falsified or misinterpreted by the healer. They may have experienced self-limiting or fluctuating illnesses, remission of which was wrongly attributed to the alternative treatment. After therapy, patients may not have been followed long enough to accurately assess cure or observe relapses. Concurrent conventional therapy is often being taken by patients who undergo alternative treatments, with inappropriate credit given to the unconventional method. Finally, misinterpretation of information by patients who believe themselves miraculously cured is often at the core of their success story. However, he points out that some of the clinical trials examining different areas of alternative therapy have raised enough questions to make further investigation of these methods desirable, in order to help answer the essential question in this debate: do these methods merely make one feel better, or do they really help one get better? "



What are you afraid of Laurie?

Posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:58:23:

In Reply to: Does this BB have a board monitor? posted by lauri on February 24, 2001 at 17:09:45:

If you don't like this thread, don't add to it by posting meaningless tripe on here about being nicey nicey.

Think about what was said here and come up with interesting, intelligent input instead of griping about nothing.



This is nothing substantial

Posted by B.B. on February 24, 2001 at 19:48:46:

In Reply to: You wanted it...you got it. posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:21:46:


Jenna,

You're believing stuff like that without sufficient proof. I've got arthritis and some those treatments work. Maybe you will quote something from your medical studies next. Testimonials are worth more than the stuff you're posting, from quackbuster on.



Re: Here's a REALLY good exerpt about why STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are good proof! :)

Posted by B.B. on February 25, 2001 at 13:09:59:

In Reply to: Here's a REALLY good exerpt about why STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are good proof! :) posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:53:08:


Jenna,

The website address did not work. Try this one.

http://www.naturalhealthvillage.com/reports/council_of_sci_affairs.htm


"State licensing, boards, influenced by the AMA, limited the practice of medicine to Graduates of accredited institutions, and research funding became the domain of the major teaching centers. "



more articles for Jenna

Posted by Bill on February 25, 2001 at 13:56:23:

In Reply to: You wanted it...you got it. posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:21:46:

FDA article on how to spot health fraud

According to the FDA website, this is the FDA's most up-to-date info on health fraud.

FDA Guide to Choosing Medical Treatments

Read carefully what they have to say about alternative therapies. It looks to me like they are saying if conventional docs can't cure your problem, go ahead and try alternative therapies, but do your homework and watch out for people who are just trying to take your money.

I found the above by going to the FDA website www.fda.gov, and searching for "fraud". There were hundreds of references - I looked at a dozen or so and thought these were worth mentioning.

Bill



To Jenna:

Posted by Rich on February 25, 2001 at 16:33:53:

In Reply to: This is nothing substantial posted by B.B. on February 24, 2001 at 19:48:46:

Jenna,

You put too much faith in quackwatch. Those people are 100% biased. There are numerous studies that back up all sorts of "alternaive medicine" therapies and principles.

I especially liked the sentance from quackwatch that says that cures from alternative medicine are the result of misdiagnosis. I guess thousands of people with LGS that followed the same protocol must have had some myesterious disease not known to science.

I just pointed out scientific proof to you. A tissue biopsy ( a conventional medicine procedure) was used in showing the LGS before and closing up after treatment. Keep in mind that LGS is a relatively new concept and it takes years and years to prove things in the lab. And anyway, what would that prove? Most scientific studies are FLAWED anway. For every article you show us from quackwatch, we could very well get studies that show the effectiveness of many therapies. I will name a few. Do some research on them.

1) Chelation therapy
2) EECP
3) Hyperbaric oxygen
4) Neurocranial Restructuring
5) Chiropractic

Guess what? No one that i know of has every been hurt by any of these therapies (except for 1 or 2 people that may have had misfortune. These things happen). These procedures have saved lives and have improved the quality of life for thousands of people. On the contrary, how many hundreds of thousands of people have died in the hands of a conventional doctor or died from complications of drug therapy? Many times more than with holistic methods.

First off, you have the whole "alternative thing" backwards. Most of us, who really know the research, are refering to "integrative medicine". This is a combination of mainstream and alternative. The best of both worlds. These doctors have traditional training and training in alternative methods.

You must be blind not to see a shift from conventional to integrative. It is happening weather you like it or not or weather quackwatch likes it or not and people are getting help for the first time when before there was none! Conventional medicine is next to USELESS against chronic degenerative diseases. Holistic medicine has had much more sucess. This is fact.

From the way you talk, I would imagine that you are between 21-25 years old. Am I right?

Rich



Ignore her Laurie. Jenna is a real ball buster!! NMI

Posted by Rich on February 25, 2001 at 16:36:04:

In Reply to: What are you afraid of Laurie? posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:58:23:

Rich



I don't care Jenna..........

Posted by Rich on February 25, 2001 at 16:37:47:

In Reply to: They have no proof that treatments for LGS work! posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 15:12:51:

about what comments you have to say. I am healed because i have intelligence and I applied it. How are you these days my dear?

Rich



Jenna, please list for us what books you have read...

Posted by Curious on February 25, 2001 at 21:36:32:

In Reply to: To Jenna: posted by Rich on February 25, 2001 at 16:33:53:

...on alternative medicine, stress, and other related topics about which you have chosen skepticism. Especially, which of the books recommended on this site have you read? The Stress of Life by Selye? Mind as Healer, Mind as Slayer by Pelletier? The Relaxation Response? Others?

Do you understand the Flexner Report?




Re: Ignore her Laurie. Jenna is a real ball buster!! NMI AND RICH THINKS HES DR KILDARE!

Posted by Eileen on February 26, 2001 at 03:33:54:

In Reply to: Ignore her Laurie. Jenna is a real ball buster!! NMI posted by Rich on February 25, 2001 at 16:36:04:

nmi



Re: Ignore her Laurie. Eileen the RN?

Posted by B.B. on February 26, 2001 at 04:50:56:

In Reply to: Re: Ignore her Laurie. Jenna is a real ball buster!! NMI AND RICH THINKS HES DR KILDARE! posted by Eileen on February 26, 2001 at 03:33:54:


Eileen,

This is a health education board, there's no place for your comment on this board.

Follow Ups:


Re: Does this BB have a board monitor?

Posted by Walt Stoll on February 26, 2001 at 11:49:32:

In Reply to: Does this BB have a board monitor? posted by lauri on February 24, 2001 at 17:09:45:

Thanks, Lauri.

My son, Bill, is the architect and manager of this 'site. He has explained our policy and frusration at this problem--as have I. Without money for a monitor, do you have any ideas? His email is  

Thanks for your input. It is hard enough to keep up with all the advances in this field but to have to cope with these "trolls" is a chore.

Namaste`

Walt



To Walt!

Posted by Rich on February 26, 2001 at 12:22:25:

In Reply to: Re: Does this BB have a board monitor? posted by Walt Stoll on February 26, 2001 at 11:49:32:

Sorry Walt. I got suckered into a brawl. I stopped posting to jenna and I will watch for these "hardcore debates" in the future. Take care!

Rich

Follow Ups:


Thanks Eileen! This is what I get for genuinely trying to help people. NMI

Posted by Rich on February 26, 2001 at 12:26:41:

In Reply to: Re: Ignore her Laurie. Jenna is a real ball buster!! NMI AND RICH THINKS HES DR KILDARE! posted by Eileen on February 26, 2001 at 03:33:54:

Rich



Re: Does this BB have a board monitor?

Posted by lauri on February 26, 2001 at 14:23:02:

In Reply to: Re: Does this BB have a board monitor? posted by Walt Stoll on February 26, 2001 at 11:49:32:

Dr. Stoll,

I asked and ISP friend of mine who says the following:
"The easiest way is to create subscriptions, that is,
everybody coming to the board has to login with a
password. In order to sign up, the user provides a valid
email address that gets a confirmation message that
must be answered from that email address. This filters
out fake email addresses, and makes people more
responsible for their actions. It also makes it easy to
block someone from posting".

Dr. Stoll, I can't believe how bad this is getting. It would
be very counterproductive to this site for people to leave
because of the nastiness. There is beginning to be too
much stress on this board, which is ironic considering
the philosophy of the site owner eh? It's your site, Dr.
Stoll, and you have every right to have your site be one
that discusses ONLY ideas that support your own, but
you don't do this, and that is why I"m here, for the pros
and cons, and the debates, and the wonderful
testimonials and helpful advice. I refuse to be baited,
and I try to avoid certain people if I can, but it's hard not
to give someone back what they dish out... I have to
admit if this crap keeps getting worse, it would probly
be better for my own health to steer away from it, and
look for other sites-I'm hanging in here for a while tho.

Lauri

I hope the above helps.


Follow Ups:


Re: Here's a REALLY good exerpt about why STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are good proof! :)

Posted by hey Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 14:51:09:

In Reply to: Here's a REALLY good exerpt about why STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are good proof! :) posted by Jenna on February 24, 2001 at 18:53:08:

If you so strongly believe that STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are worthwhile, then why were you so convinced by kmd's TESTIMONIAL about B5? Convinced enough you said, that you will try it next. What, no double-blind studies on that before you will try it?



Hey chickens**t anonymous person!!

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:26:16:

In Reply to: Re: Here's a REALLY good exerpt about why STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are good proof! :) posted by hey Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 14:51:09:

here's my post...I am on a medication for acne that works really well (Azelex) but does nothing for the oil thang and girl I hate that oil!!!! That's exciting news and I'm happy that it's working for you!

Where on it does it say that I'm going to be trying it? I'm researching on it...LOL!! I just knew you were going to try this and I've been waiting anxiously for this one!! LMAO!



Thanks B.B.--sorry about the link nmi

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:27:08:

In Reply to: Re: Here's a REALLY good exerpt about why STUDIES not TESTIMONIALS are good proof! :) posted by B.B. on February 25, 2001 at 13:09:59:

nmi

Follow Ups:


Rich...Hulda Clark, who was touted on this very board is being sued, has been arrested for HEALTH FRAUD

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:28:49:

In Reply to: To Jenna: posted by Rich on February 25, 2001 at 16:33:53:

You think Quackwatch is posting wrong information about that on there?



Re:Check your spelling Jenna

Posted by B.B. on February 26, 2001 at 17:28:59:

In Reply to: Hey chickens**t anonymous person!! posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:26:16:


Jenna,

Assuming you meant something other than thang. What happened to you trying?



Bill, it says on the 2nd site that an alternative practitioner should be willing to work with a person's regular doctor

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:31:33:

In Reply to: more articles for Jenna posted by Bill on February 25, 2001 at 13:56:23:

Dr. Stoll is so busy cutting down all doctors that that just isn't a possibility on this board. He tries to convince everyone that all doctors are out to get people.



Who is "us"? nmi

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:32:34:

In Reply to: Jenna, please list for us what books you have read... posted by Curious on February 25, 2001 at 21:36:32:

nmi



Since you asked...

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:34:29:

In Reply to: I don't care Jenna.......... posted by Rich on February 25, 2001 at 16:37:47:

I'm doing great!!!

I have a wonderful job, husband, dog, parents and even after getting my Bachelor's degree--I'm back in school and working a full-time job. And I'm 28 years old, so you're wrong again. No surprise there!



Jenna

Posted by B.B. on February 26, 2001 at 17:34:51:

In Reply to: Bill, it says on the 2nd site that an alternative practitioner should be willing to work with a person's regular doctor posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:31:33:


Hi, Jenna

Sorry to interfere, however, Dr Stoll does NOT knock all the doctors. If you were to read more of the archives, you would read where he refers people to their regulars doctors.



I meant thang as slang--jeez louise do some SR

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 18:08:04:

In Reply to: Re:Check your spelling Jenna posted by B.B. on February 26, 2001 at 17:28:59:

I'll admit when I'm wrong, but I'm not in this instance.

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Being a martyr isn't good for your health...

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 18:12:01:

In Reply to: Thanks Eileen! This is what I get for genuinely trying to help people. NMI posted by Rich on February 26, 2001 at 12:26:41:

Here, let me help you up on that cross...



All the while, making snide remarks about how greedy and stupid they are..

Posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 18:13:33:

In Reply to: Jenna posted by B.B. on February 26, 2001 at 17:34:51:

How he's SO far ahead of them...

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Yes it is wrong!

Posted by Rich on February 26, 2001 at 20:59:17:

In Reply to: Rich...Hulda Clark, who was touted on this very board is being sued, has been arrested for HEALTH FRAUD posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:28:49:

Jenna, this is old news. I know the whole story. once again, this is because she is a pioneer in certain techniques and theories and the primitives have a hard time understanding her. did you know that she made 70 HIV positive people HIV negatative in 7 days? Well, she did.

Rich

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Sorry. I am usually a good judge of character but your posts are so infinitle that I thought you were younger. I feel REALLY bad for that poor man in your house.

Posted by Rich on February 26, 2001 at 21:01:07:

In Reply to: Since you asked... posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:34:29:

nmi



Neither is being a nag!!!

Posted by Rich on February 26, 2001 at 21:02:18:

In Reply to: Being a martyr isn't good for your health... posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 18:12:01:

nmi

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That's what I thought. You've not read ANYTHING we're talking about here.

Posted by Curious on February 27, 2001 at 11:58:30:

In Reply to: Who is "us"? nmi posted by Jenna on February 26, 2001 at 17:32:34:

Which means you are speaking out of "ignorance" of course.



Jenna comes across with a teenager mentality. (nmi)

Posted by I agree on February 27, 2001 at 12:01:17:

In Reply to: Sorry. I am usually a good judge of character but your posts are so infinitle that I thought you were younger. I feel REALLY bad for that poor man in your house. posted by Rich on February 26, 2001 at 21:01:07:

nm

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Re: That's what I thought. You've not read ANYTHING we're talking about here.

Posted by Walt Stoll on March 01, 2001 at 08:03:05:

In Reply to: That's what I thought. You've not read ANYTHING we're talking about here. posted by Curious on February 27, 2001 at 11:58:30:

Thanks, Curious.

Did you really expect anything else?

Namaste`

Walt

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