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Hi :)
Well, I’m almost through with my elimination diet. I’ve been hungry a lot of the time, and I’ve experienced cravings for sweets, crunchy grain-derived crackers, etc. But I do feel extremely “clean” inside.
I just analyzed the food I ate for the last few days, and realize that while I’m getting a decent amount of fiber and a ton of protein, I haven’t been consuming nearly enough calories (even though it seems like I’m cooking and eating or planning what to cook constantly). I figure I’ve been getting between 1200 and 1500 (approx) a day, and that is nowhere near enough for me. So that probably explains the hunger. I’ve tried to eat only one piece of fruit a day or LESS (because of my Candida) so I’ve eaten more veggies and that probably explains the calorie deficit.
While I did experience some minor withdrawal symptoms the first few days (mild fatigue, dizziness, headache and sinus pressure) I didn’t really experience much in the way of a “clearing”. From what I have read of Rob’s posts, this is typical for someone who (a) has a large overgrowth of Candida, and (b) has other issues like MCS.
Unfortunately, last night my boyfriend and I had to clean out the bedroom and closet of our apt because we had some water damage a few weeks ago and maintenance was coming to clean the carpets et al today. We revealed a lot of mold that we hadn’t found before... long story short --- I breathed in a lot of mold, dust, cleaning products, scented candles etc, and went to bed/woke up with a swollen throat, congestion, sinus pressure, etc. This really ticks me off, because I’ve worked so hard to stay on this diet, and now I don’t even have a neutral body to test on due to all the friggin’ chemicals!!! I HATE them!!@$
Anyway, I’m not going to start testing foods till Friday, in hope that I clear up a decent amount by then.
Per your suggestions, I am starting with the Hunter-Gatherer “core” foods. I also want to test things like brown rice, wheat and dairy. Then I will test some of the Agriculturist “core” foods that I eat regularly. From what I understand, a Mixed diet is usually about 67% hunter-gatherer core foods, and 33% Agriculturist core foods. Is that how you understand it to be as well? I can’t seem to find any posts that are too specific re: the Mixed diet. I’m of course hoping I might fall into that category... because it seems to offer the better menu selection (lol).
I’m concerned that I won’t experience any symptoms to any foods (or I won’t be “sensitive” enough to notice them). But I’ve come this far, and so I’m going to just complete this whole test accurately anyway.
If I do experience some minor symptoms to some food (other than grains or dairy) and I take the alka-seltzer gold and then have no symptoms in 5 hours or so, would it be OK to move on and test another food? Or do you think I have to wait a day before testing the next food? Realistically, what are the guidelines?
Labrat, do YOU eat grains? Cutting out wheat (or limiting to a few times a year) is easy enough, but to also cut out rice, oats, corn, etc... it seems risky to me. I think I’d prefer to take a more moderate approach. What are your thoughts concerning the elimination of grains?
Just wanted to update you on my progress. And as usually, I really appreciate any thoughts you may have.
Thanks,
:) Wendy
In Reply to: For Labrat (or anyone else interested) Re: my E-Diet posted by Wendy O. on September 25, 2002 at 17:12:53:
Hi Wendy O.
I think it's a good idea to wait. You should clear up a bit by then.
You are definitely not the first person who said they hoped they are mixed. In reality Mixed folks are very rare, so it's not impossible, but highly unlikely that you'll fall into that category. I'd try to stick to HG foods at first, at least for 2 or 3 days (sort of get a baseline for how you feel) and then gradually blend in the AG foods after you feel a bit more sure of where you are. That way you won't confuse yourself (any more than necessary!). Basically, try to change only 1 thing at a time - even your exercise level - so that if you DO feel bad, you will know why. And since you DO plan on testing the more "dangerous" stuff like wheat and dairy, save that for last...meaning around the 3rd week or so of testing. By then you should have a good variety of "safe" foods, since you won't be able to test anything else for the 8 days - 4 days for wheat and 4 for dairy. BTW, if you feel bad before the 4 days are up, then stop the testing, and wait until you feel better again before testing the next food.
Realistically, after you have a reaction and possibly need to take the alka-seltzer gold, then you can test another food when you feel "over" the reaction...a few hours after you take the ASG. However long it takes you to feel better - you don't want to confuse a new reaction with an old reaction!
I reacted much like you - not a lot of clearing. At the time, I did have a candida problem, so it does go along with what you read.
As far as grains - I only eat rice and some 100% rye bread, but I don't eat either of them very often. Rice every few weeks and rye toast sometimes on weekends with my eggs. I haven't had rice for most of the summer. I use them as "treat" foods - especially the rye. One of my only real strong reactions was to oats, and a lesser one to corn. Wheat I don't "react" to as an allergy, but I find that I get easily addicted to it and it PACKS on the pounds for me - plus saps my energy taking up space that should be filled with meat! It's just not worth eating it except for extremely rare occasions, Christmas party dessert for instance, and if I've had it recently for ANOTHER rare occasion, I'll skip that too. It's a bit like drinking alcohol - it tastes great while you're having fun, but you pay for it later.
I think that your concern about no grains being "risky" is a result of years of public brainwashing about grains. We really don't *need* them to be healthy - especially HGs. The real test for you will be simply to see how YOU feel when you eat them, and how you feel when you don't. Perhaps your moderate approach will work for you.
Pardon me but I don't remember what exactly your problems are, but since you HAVE problems, you might find yourself on the extreme side of things. Those who are not extreme tend to get along better with a moderate varied diet...and therefore don't develop problems like those of us who are at teh extreme ends of the metabolic spectrum. I hope I explained that alright...
Keep it up, you are getting to the fun part. It's exciting adding the new stuff back in. I couldn't believe how good steak tasted after the e-diet!
~~~8>
In Reply to: Re: For Labrat (or anyone else interested) Re: my E-Diet posted by labrat on September 25, 2002 at 23:36:27:
Wow, you really don't eat many grains. When I cut out refined grains recently, I let myself liberally substitute with brown rice, oats, brown rice crackers, rye crackers, occasional homemade whole wheat products, various whole grain pasta, etc. It seems like it would be really hard to reduce these as much as you have. I guess it's because they're just so convenient to prepare/consume etc. I wonder if once LGS is cured our bodies could handle troublesome grains better?
If these "Metabolic-type" concepts were widely acknowledged, can you imagine how our social structure would shift? Personals would read: "Looking for sensitive Hunter-Gatherer, 25-35". Restaurants would have different menus. I believe my boyfriend is an AG (because of his eating habits and his 100% Italian background). In any event, our bodies DEFINATELY don't like the same foods. That I can already tell. Makes life difficult, eh?
I would have thought that most people are Mixed... But if they're rare maybe that's why McFerran didn't devote much time to discussing it here. I really need to get Wiley's book, etc. I'd like to learn more about these theories.
FYI: The main problems which led me to this board where chronic yeast infections and MCS (I had been diagnosed with "Environmental Illness"). But these symptoms aren't things that you can test with diet changes. The biggest problem is that the symptoms hang on a long time. For example, if I'm in a bar for 2 hours (smoke) I will be sick for 4 weeks, *minimum*. If I come to work and don't sit in my new "clean" room with a vent and 2 hepa filters, I will have lung/respiratory symptoms for 5 days or so (because of the formaldehyde in the furniture). And then of course the yeast infection never really goes away. It gets better, but I can always tell it hasn't left me...
I have other problems (that I never used to consider problems) that I can tell will be resolved by SR or something similar. I have read on this board about others who had vaginal pain (abraded areas in the vagina). I have this but always associated it to yeast infections. I also have really tightened anal muscles, which make it difficult to go to the bathroom. But I'm not often "constipated" (especially not now!). A while ago I discovered I could go easily (without ripping myself that is) if I use those new Cottonelle soft-wipes to massage myself open (I know this is gross, *sorry*). But I've recently found other posts on this board where people report the same problem. Walt has pointed to chronic levator ani bracing, and has indicated the best solution to be SR. So, I believe that in the end, SR may be the most important leg of the stool for me.
I've just been trying to concentrate on diet first though. If I try to do too much at once, I will just quit. I've been doing SR occasionally (but not twice or even once every day yet), and I haven't gone through the "workbook" yet...
What were/are the health problems *you're* trying to deal with? Is arthritis or diabetes one of them? I wonder if diet changes won't help with my problems as much? They certainly can't hurt, but they may just not be the big answer. who knows. And I was only on the whole foods diet for a month before starting this e-diet, so it's not like I was *actually* eating a good balanced diet before..
Thanks again for all of your advice.
I DO really look forward to that lamb tomorrow! Yum yum! I'm going to test olive oil first though, because I'm sick of not being able to use it!
Have a good day!
:) Wendy
In Reply to: For Labrat (or anyone else interested) Re: my E-Diet posted by Wendy O. on September 25, 2002 at 17:12:53:
Thanks, Wendy O.
Did you ever think that, had you not just done a cleansing, that the exposed mold might have totally done you in?
Walt
In Reply to: Re: For Labrat (or anyone else interested) Re: my E-Diet posted by Walt Stoll on September 26, 2002 at 10:13:39:
Hi Walt :)
Well, I know that mold can't be *good* for me. Mostly, it's the cleaning products and scented candles that bothered me two nights ago I think (and lately too much dust in the air bothers me too). It is possible however that my reaction might have been worse two months ago. Hard to know. It's only two days later and I am greatly improved. It will be easier to gauge after 6-12 months when (hopefully) my reaction is *noticably* reduced to things like this.
From what I observe, my reactions are not to natural things (mold, dustmites(sp?), pet dander, pollen, anything outside, etc.) My reactions are only to chemicals (cigarettes (with filters: ie chemicals), cleaning products (this isle in the store KILLS me), my new office furniture, etc). And when I get bad, I can't be around people with perfume on.
Last Nov. I did see an allergist and have the full gamut of allergy tests (including multiple molds). They were *all* negative. (Which I know may not mean much). But he said they didn't DO tests for chemicals. He said those where just considered "irritants". Of course, I had a colorful comment in my mind for him then, which I kept to myself of course. "I'd like to irritate...@##^$!"
I believe that eventually the steps I'm taking will help my reactions to be lighter, but I know that I'm not there yet...
Thanks for all your help! This site is a great source of info.
:) Wendy
In Reply to: Re: For Labrat (or anyone else interested) Re: my E-Diet posted by Wendy O. on September 26, 2002 at 10:41:11:
After thinking about it more I realize that my reaction WOULD have been much worse 2 months ago. Thanks for helping me see a positive angle here!
:)
In Reply to: Re: For Labrat (or anyone else interested) Re: my E-Diet posted by labrat on September 25, 2002 at 23:36:27:
(or dairy) do you eat it three times a day for 4 days, once and then wait 4 days till a reaction, three times the first day then wait four days for a reaction, etc. How should I schedule this?
In Reply to: Labrat, when you're testing a grain... posted by Wendy O. on September 26, 2002 at 11:39:05:
It's 3 times a day for 4 days, once. But that's the ONLY food you can test for those 4 days, nothing else that isn't already deemed "safe".
Generally what Bob found was that while some folks get a reaction right away, for others it can take a few days for symptoms to manifest from these foods. Here's why: Some foods cause an immunological response and those are the foods where you react promptly; most of the foods your testing. Other foods can be literally *damaging* to the intestinal tract, causing more LGS, and thus reactions that take more time to manifest. As the 4 days pass and the damage mounts, your symptoms become apparent.
I'm a good example. Like I said, I can eat wheat with no problem for awhile, but in the long run, it gets to me.
So for scheduling, wait until you've tested other more important foods and added them back in to your diet. That way you'll maintain a good variety while you're stuck testing just the wheat. Let's say two days into the wheat testing you find yourself with no energy at all, or sore, or with a headache, then quit testing, chock it up to a reaction and wait until you feel better again before testing the dairy in the same manner.
Of course, if you have no problems with the food, continue the testing for the whole 4 days. If you get through the 4 days with no reaction, then you found another safe food. Just be sure you keep writing in your journal how you feel...
Carry on!
~~~8>
In Reply to: It's like this... posted by labrat on September 26, 2002 at 13:10:36:
SEPARATELY test wheat 4 days, rye another 4 days, oats another 4 days, etc. So pick your favorites and start with those!
In Reply to: p.s. Of course, it's one type of grain at a time... posted by labrat on September 26, 2002 at 13:19:03:
How much of each food should I consume when testing it? I'm thinking it should be 1/3 to 1/2 of my meal. So, for example, if I'm testing asparagus I might have a good helping of asparagus, and a fillet of trout. Does that sound right? Or should I JUST be eating as much of the asparagus as I can to fill myself up for that meal?
Just want to make sure I do this right.
Thanks for your help with the grain protocol.
:) Wendy
In Reply to: Re: For Labrat (or anyone else interested) Re: my E-Diet posted by Wendy O. on September 26, 2002 at 10:41:11:
Thanks, Wendy O.
Remember that it is the combination of everything that overwhelmes the immune system. There is no way that you can avoid more than a small % of what is out there. SO, in my opinion, your only real option is serious wellness (which you have already started).
In the meantime you need a much better "allergist". With anything but a certified Clinical Ecologist, you are wasting your money and time.
Walt
In Reply to: OK, LAST question! posted by Wendy O. on September 26, 2002 at 14:45:05:
Wendy,
Please don't worry about asking questions! That's what this is all about after all. BTW, I know I repeat stuff a lot...it's not because I don't think you're catching on, it's just that I've found people have so much to think about during this time that it is helpful...you have been a joy to help with this!
I just ate a "normal" portion of the new food. I think you're looking at it the right way. Make a meal of safe foods and one new food. Eat regular portions for you of each food. If testing steak for instance, you might have the entire steak if you're a big eater or hungry, or half of it if you're like me, along with two or three safe side dishes - maybe steamed carrots and celery. Eat enough to be satisfied. Then if you don't react, for the next meal you might try sauteeing some beef along with carrots and celery in olive oil...the oil being the new food in that case. Once you've determined that olive oil is safe, you can sautee new foods in it - say asparagus, chicken, or potatoes. Just continue making balanced meals out of safe foods with one new food each time.
Between meals, if you find yourself hungry, you can simply have a snack of anything you've already tested that is safe. Don't walk around hungry. This is also a good way to continue testing and refining your metabolic needs - if a plain apple for a snack leaves you without energy, maybe you need more protein and/or fat along with your carbs, such as a little meat snack or nut butter, or a hard boiled egg or something.
Don't worry about pinpointing the entire picture right now - you're mostly just weeding through allergens for now. The rest of your dietary needs will be determined over time and testing of portions and ratios of safe foods, without allergens mucking up how you really feel. It's beautifully simple if you trust the process!
Enjoy!
~~~8>
In Reply to: As usual, thanks for your long reply :) posted by Wendy O. on September 26, 2002 at 10:10:47:
Wendy,
I had chronic fatigue, CRS, LGS, rosacea and a bit of arthritis starting. Most of these problems are mostly gone. I need to stick with the program more strictly than I do. I know it works because for about a year, I did it all perfectly- SR, diet and exercise. I never felt better! It is unfortunatly hard to maintain. I am working toward getting there again so that my own current problems, that have to do with my menses, can clear up.
For me, (and it sounds like for you, too) the SR is critical. My bracing causes all my other problems, so...
I will tell you that sticking with a pure diet will help you tremendously with the SR. When I have sugar or some other "bad" foods, I can't settle down enough to do the SR properly. It really is all interconnected...my exercising released the muscle tension and the diet kept me peaceful enough to do the SR. The SR and a good diet gave me the energy to keep up the exercise. Doing the SR and the exercise well gave me the impetus to stay on the diet.
You may ask then why and how did this wonderful chain break??? It's sort of a conundrum. I got to feeling so good that I thought it wouldn't hurt to "treat" myself. I started "cheating" with caffeine and wheat and sugar...it slowly got out of hand...then life happened, things changed and I had other priorities. I slowly did less of the program, and promised myself I'd start again soon...Now I need to "weave" these things back into my more complex life. It's a journey, that's for sure!
~~~8>
In Reply to: it's okay if it's NOT the last question! :-) posted by labrat on September 27, 2002 at 12:22:13:
I really appreciate it. I sort of feel guilty that you're taking all this time to write so much to me. Many times I later find things in the archives after you've answered them, and I know I shouldn't waste your time like that, etc... I should just try to find the answers myself first. In any event, I wanted to say thanks a bunch.
SO, the below is NOT a question, I'm just sharing... ;)
I didn't react to olive oil (thankfully). But you were right, parsnips sauteed in olive oil are sweet and delicious! Who knew?!
Unfortunately, I think I did just react to asparagus. Ate alot of it almost 2 hours ago. Am having same symptoms I had during withrawal period (*mild* fogginess/dizziness/fatigue and a slight twinge of a headache). At first I brushed it off to not enough sleep and the yucky rainy weather. But then when I went out for a drive to get some air, moving my head made the sympoms more accute (and fresh air usually wakes me up). So I'm pretty sure this was a response to the asparagus.
And that just seems odd. I chose what I thought would be "safe" foods for the first two days. I guess I'll just have to wait and see what happens. I'm concerned now that I'm either (a) going to turn out to be one of those people who are sensitive to everything (even though I *thought* I would be sensitive to nothing), or (b) that I just inaccurately labeled myself as an H-G. At some point I'd like to have that 5-hour glucose test done.
In any event, I'll post more in a few days, after I have more reactions (or hopefully lack there of) to go on.
Thanks for all the info about your journey. You've clearly been at this for quite a while and have gained a LOT of insight. I can see how it IS very easy to drift away from perfect wellness, especially if you've started feeling healthy again. Our society just isn't designed to support wellness. I'm already worried about Christmas (lol!)
Take care,
:) Wendy
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