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I was using insulin for 3 weeks. ON the first week, I took 8iu of Humulin "r" in the morning with my brakfast and 15iu after my workout with a big meal and weight gainer shake (lots of sugar). ON week two, I got stupid and only consumed sugar one hour after my post workout injection. I went into Hypoglycemia abut 3 times that week when I took n sugar too late. On the first one, I went into hypo twice in two hours. I also noticed numbness in my arms. On week 3, I went into hypo again and the numbness got worse and spread to my legs. I went off of insulin and went to the doctor. He tooka bloodt est and my Blood Sugar level was fine. MOst of the numbness is now gone. I suspect that I had nerve damage.
Also, I now notice a loss of vision in my right eye during this time. I'm giong to see an eye doctor next week. What should I suggest to the doctor? I hear that they do something like inject a yellow substance intravenously so that the eye crystals turn yellow making it easier to se if they are exploding or breaking down or somehting.
Anyone?
In Reply to: I used Insulin for bodybuilding purposes and I messed myself up. posted by Matt on August 10, 1999 at 19:01:07:
Hi Matt,
the insulin oversupply causes your overall hormonal balance to change. It suppresses some enzymes and activates some other, so the result is your body producing more proinflammation, vasoconstriction, platelet aggregation, allergy causing (etc.) eicosanoids. It was not a good idea at all to take supplemental insulin, it probably cannot help you build muscle mass, just fat mass. I think dr. Sears in his book The Zone described well what is going on when there's excess insulin, suppressing its opposite hormone, the glucagon.
Be well,
Karel
In Reply to: Excess insulin brings problems posted by Karel on August 11, 1999 at 06:48:20:
HI,
I noticed a huge increase in muscle mass. 17 pounds of total mass in 17 days. I was stacking it with steroids, but when I stopped the insulin, the gains stopped instantly. Insulin did INSTANT wonders to my muscle size, but It was a mistake! With steroids, at least I can push the envelope a little and still be quite safe, but one slip with insulin and I can end up dead.
Insulin basically force feeds the muscles. It's amazing, but not worth the risks. Everyone "in the know" said to me that it was safe and the dangers are overplayed. These people are idiots! I had damage from going in hypoglycemia.
Instant numbness. It was horrible. I re-evaluated my life at that point. I came out a better man, that's for sure.
In Reply to: Re: Excess insulin brings problems posted by Matt on August 11, 1999 at 07:09:01:
Did you have a before and after bodyfat comp done?
In Reply to: Re: Excess insulin brings problems posted by Matt on August 11, 1999 at 07:09:01:
Hi Matt,
insulin also takes the glucose out of the blood stream and stores it into liver and muscle cells. If there's not enough blood glucose (hypoglycemia) to feed the brain, it may start work unproperly - there I would see the connection with the numbness in your periferal nervous system.
We are all different, so what may have caused no harm to some people, does harm to some other.
Be well,
Karel
In Reply to: glucose, brain and numbness in the PNS posted by Karel on August 11, 1999 at 15:55:36:
So that's probably why I lost vision in my right eye? It happened at the same time, so It has to be. I just want to know the mechanics of it. I seems to be getting worse... or maybe I'm just paying more attention to it.
In Reply to: How do you know it wasn't 17 lbs. of FAT gain? posted by Lincoln on August 11, 1999 at 13:01:32:
Because I added 2 inches to my neck (no fat on the traps and neck) and over an inch on biceps and forearms exploded.
I did put on fat, but not too much. I stayed lean.
I know a guy who is insulin dependant and once he had to start using it, his gains and strenth rose high. Insulin is used by nearly every pro bodybuilder. "naturals" attest to using it because steriods are detectable. I was stacking it with some steroids also, and the gains were phenomenol. I took my share of hefty doses of steroids in the past and I didn't come close to 17 pounds in 17 days. I take a moderate dose of steriods and some insulin and I exploded.
BUt that was stupid. Anyone who takes insulin for anything other than diabetic problems is a crazy mo-fo. I'm glad I didn't go instantly blind or did serious damage to myself. I'm kinda glad that it happened, because I was on the wrong track and was headed for SERIOUS health problems. What I experienced, I consider miniscule to what can happen from stupidity. I'm greatful that It didn't take a heart attack or liver cancer or brain damage to wane my stupidity.
In Reply to: Re: How do you know it wasn't 17 lbs. of FAT gain? posted by Matt on August 12, 1999 at 07:52:52:
DNP used in the production of dynamite that raises the metabolism by 'cooking' you. It's the same mechanism used in many pesticides. Steroids are as safe as aspirin in comparison!
Just curious, how did your experience with steroids go health-wise? Were you taking 'therapeutic' dosages or 'gonzo bodybuilding' dosages? How's your liver? Blood lipids?
In Reply to: Re: glucose, brain and numbness in the PNS posted by Matt on August 12, 1999 at 07:44:40:
Probably yes. Vision is one of brain functions - the eyes can be seen as a part of the brain in a way.
Also, hyperinsulinemia is said to be a much better predictor of heart and other problems than blood cholesterol. I believe it is reasonable to keep your or anybody's (natural) insulin and glucagon as stable as possible, just like it is described in The Zone by dr. Sears.
Karel
In Reply to: Glad to hear you survived! Insulin is the second most dangerous bodybuilding drug - DNP being the first. posted by Lincoln on August 12, 1999 at 12:09:12:
I once used 150mg of anadrol stacked with 1g of enanthate for 4 weeks. It was horrible. y gut grew making me look pregnant, I lost hair and broke out with severe acne...... small cyst-like acne on my back. Ewwww.
I had my blood pressure checked and it was OK. I still have to get my liver enzymes checked. How do they check it? Urine?
In Reply to: I used Insulin for bodybuilding purposes and I messed myself up. posted by Matt on August 10, 1999 at 19:01:07:
Matt.
Who suggested such a stupid thing for you to do?
Let us know what you learn from the eye doc. Be sure to tell her what you did.
Walt
In Reply to: Re: Glad to hear you survived! Insulin is the second most dangerous bodybuilding drug - DNP being the first. posted by Matt on August 12, 1999 at 19:16:45:
nm
In Reply to: Re: I used Insulin for bodybuilding purposes and I messed myself up. posted by Walt Stoll on August 13, 1999 at 10:36:23:
It seems doctors can cut you up for plastic surgery, but they won't (or can't) advise the public on drug use for body building. That's how guys like this get into trouble. Doctors won't monitor his use nor provide a safe alternative (like legal - and sane - doses of steroids for cosmetic purposes, which is safer than many types plastic surgery, IMO.) "Just Say No" and burying your head in the sand doesn't work for drug use just as it doesn't work for teen sex or abortion. The principles are the same - people are going to do it anyway. Education on the consequences, providing alternatives, and helping 'users' establish safe practices is what works.
Using insulin to 'drive' nutrients into muscle tissue is a somewhat common thing in the professional bodybuilding world. Just like steroids, it's use is neither tested for by the pro body building federations nor monitored by doctors. For that we might blame Joe Weider - founder of Weider Nutrition, Muscle & Fitness Magazine, Flex Magazine, the International Federation of Body Builders, financial sponsor of many steroid using top pro bodybuilders such as Arnold S., etc. He practically invented the industry and rules it to this day. When asked about re-instituting steroid testing in IFBB competitions - dropped years ago but still steroid use is still illegal in the IFBB rule books - he was alleged to have responded, "What? Do you want the [competitors] to look like worms?"
Joe never mentions in his ads that the bodybuilders who endorse his products and workout routines often take MASSIVE amounts of drugs - I'm talking 10x the normal therapeutic dose and even higher. Steroids, diuretics, themogenics, anti-aromatases, clenbuterol, DNP, insulin, growth hormone (Humatrope), vet drugs like Winstrol-V, you name it. His ads imply, "Do the workouts in my magazines, take my supplements. You'll get as big and strong as the IFBB pros." What an incredible white lie.
You want to be shocked? Go to the back issues of Testosterone Magazine at http:\\www.t-mag.com. Read the articles "The Dead Pool" June 12th or "The Dead Pool 99" July 16, 1999 about the 10 bodybuilders most likely to die next. See "Advanced Warfare - An Interview With Paul Borresen" May 7, 1999 to read about a guy taking mind blowing doses. Quote: "For the first ten days, I take 1000 mg of Sustanon a day. Days 11 to 20, I take 800 mg of Deca, 400 mg of Primobolan, and 600 mg of test propionate a day. Days 21 to 30, I do 400 mg of propionate, 200 mg of Winstrol, and four of my Triple X capsules, which are a homemade combination of Dinatropinol, T3, and oral insulin. I also take a 30-IU shot of insulin every time I eat a meal." Yikes.
In Reply to: Re: I used Insulin for bodybuilding purposes and I messed myself up. posted by Walt Stoll on August 13, 1999 at 10:36:23:
Some guys weresaying it was safe as long as you take sugar. Idiots.
If I tell the doctor about the insulin, might the insurance not cover it since it was my fault?
In Reply to: Head in the sand attitude of FDA and AMA (long) posted by Lincoln on August 13, 1999 at 18:34:39:
Thanks, Lincoln.
This is an eyeopener for me.
Walt
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