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Eliminating dairy from diet

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Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by Deyla on August 23, 2002 at 13:47:17:

Over the past couple years, I've been making the transition over to becoming a vegiterian. I've never been much of a meat or fish eater, and now I hardly touch chicken or eggs.
I was wondering if it would be a smart move to elimate dairy from my diet too. What would be the health benefits or vice versa?
Also, should I try to implement meat and fish back into my diet? I mean, I don't have anything particulary against meat, I just thought I might be better off without it.



Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by R. on August 23, 2002 at 15:08:25:

In Reply to: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Deyla on August 23, 2002 at 13:47:17:

should I try to implement meat and fish back into my diet? I mean, I don't have anything particulary against meat, I just thought I might be better off without it.

I used to think so too. I didn't have any evidence to support that idea; I just read something about vegetarianism and mindlessly followed along the idea that eating meat is unnatural.

When I began to use a little more critical thinking, I abandoned that idea and benefited from doing that.

According to Dr. Weston Price and other researchers, there has never been a vegetarian (I mean the full sense of the word -- eating only vegetation) people in the world, at least one most individuals of which displayed vibrant health.

I would suggest that you read Nutrition and Physical Degeneration by Weston Price. You can buy it from http://www.price-pottenger.org or download it for free (possibly illegally) from http://www.soilandhealth.org/02/0203cat/020314price/020314toc.html. You can find out if it's legal to get the free electronic copy at http://www.soilandhealth.org/copyform.asp?bookcode=020314.

I would also recommend that you read http://www.powerhealth.net/selected_articles.htm and peruse The Weston A. Price Foundation's web site. Then make up your mind if avoiding animal based food is wise for you. For many people it isn't.

Regarding dairy, if you have health problems caused by dairy, see if switching to raw (unpasteurized), unhomogenized, free of artificial hormones and antibiotics dairy helps before dropping it from your diet.

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Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by Mary on August 23, 2002 at 18:50:24:

In Reply to: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Deyla on August 23, 2002 at 13:47:17:

I have just as many books for you that support eliminating ALL animal products from your diet. Here are some for starters:

"Conscious Eating" by Gabriel Cousins, M.D.
"Food Revolution" by John Robbins
"Sick and Tired, Reclaim Your Inner Terrain" by Dr. Robert Young, Ph.D., D.Sc.
"The pH Miracle" by Dr. Rober Young, Ph.D, D.Sc.

Do your COMPLETE research. Don't just reasearch one side.

Mary



Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by Happygal on August 23, 2002 at 21:08:21:

In Reply to: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Deyla on August 23, 2002 at 13:47:17:

Hi Deyla,

Why don't you experiment with each of those things and see what your body tells you?

Happygal

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Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by R. on August 23, 2002 at 21:11:08:

In Reply to: Re: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Mary on August 23, 2002 at 18:50:24:

Mary,

Are you aware of at least one people whose all individuals excluded ALL animal foods and were healthy... from generation to generation to generation to generation...?

Without confirming a theory with practice, theory remains just a theory.



Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by Mary on August 23, 2002 at 21:49:38:

In Reply to: Re: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by R. on August 23, 2002 at 21:11:08:

Maybe not, but I do know of SEVERAL generation to generation to generation of individuals who consume animal products who are unhealthy, have heart disease, cancer, diabetes, etc. and die prematurely. Touche!



Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by labrat on August 23, 2002 at 23:17:45:

In Reply to: Re: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Mary on August 23, 2002 at 21:49:38:

but that doesn't mean much - there are many examples of those who consume animal products and are healthy. THe eskimos and other indigenous peoples consume tons of animal products including a lot of fat and they are heathly from generation to generation...

Researching both sides as you suggested, I, like R. found that there isn't much good evidence to support a totally non-meat diet.

From personal experience, I tried the vegetarian route and it was enough to push me over the edge into chronic fatigue, LGS and candida...

Everyone needs a different diet and some of us will need much less meat than others, but all of us need SOME animal protein to stay healthy in the long run.

~~~8>



Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by R. on August 24, 2002 at 02:59:00:

In Reply to: Re: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by labrat on August 23, 2002 at 23:17:45:

True. Weston Price, in his Nutrition and Physical Degeneration, described many indigenous peoples that displayed great health, and all of them included some amount of animal foods. Some of them were predominantly meat eaters. Those who were predominantly plant eaters (BUT totally vegetarians) were observed to be less healthy than others. Price wasn't the only researcher who made these observations.

Mary makes a logical mistake of confusing correlation with causality. Just because people she knows consume animals products and suffer from health problem that she listed doesn't mean that the animal products caused those problems. I would bet that those people do other things in addition to eating animal foods: live with chronic stress, eat lots of refined carbohydrates and other types of manufactured foods, breath contaminated air, etc. -- everything that can and do cause all the maladies Mary listed.

From a logical perspective, it seems wiser to use a diet that is similar to one of those that have already been demonstrated (in real life) to allow people to have good health for many, many generations. However, I am perfectly fine with the idea that some people experiment on themselves and their children to see if their no-animal-foods diets can provide them with great health for generations. We have plenty of folks to spare for experiments. I just don't want my loved ones to take part in the experiment.

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Re: Eliminating dairy from diet (How to tell if helpful.) Archive in e-diet.

Posted by Walt Stoll on August 24, 2002 at 09:27:41:

In Reply to: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Deyla on August 23, 2002 at 13:47:17:

Hi, Deyla.

I would try total elimination for a couple of weeks and then have some. You will know the answer to your question.

THEN, you can do the same thing with any meat, fish, chicken or eggs--one at a time. Your body will tell you.

Let us know what you learn.

Walt

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Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by Terri-Lynn on August 24, 2002 at 09:38:36:

In Reply to: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Deyla on August 23, 2002 at 13:47:17:

At different times our body needs different things; Following intuition has known to help many;
Health of the body changes, a persons vibrations changes, our enviroment and amount of toxins on our planet changes and one must be in tune with one's body or learn to do some muscle testing;
You can try some different things when your body is so cleared out and see what feels right to you! You'll know!
When i feel to acid, i back off any fish, meat, eggs-products like that for a period of time and when i put it back i tune in and usually start with small amounts; Sometimes i eat fish and back up off the grain family awhile, it just depends what is going on or what i intuitively feel;
I also love this technical info that R gave you! Use it all and then read if you want, just don't get so confussed that you don't listen to that inner voice inside beyond the theories [or your following another only]; To blend both is good-have the info and then feel it out and then try things!

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Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by bing on August 24, 2002 at 13:12:28:

In Reply to: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Deyla on August 23, 2002 at 13:47:17:

Some nutrients (such as B 12) don't exist in plant foods, yet we DO need them for optimal health. Personally, I disagree with any extremist view--like "all exclusive" ideas. But, LISTEN TO YOUR BODY seems the best policy.



Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by Mary on August 26, 2002 at 10:18:29:

In Reply to: Re: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by bing on August 24, 2002 at 13:12:28:

As I understand it, the human body produces vitamin B12 in the colon. The reason that someone may become vitamin B12 deficient (meat eaters as well as non-meat eaters) is because they have a problem with the healthy flora in their colon. Many people have a vitamin B12 deficiency.



Re: Eliminating dairy from diet

Posted by bing on August 26, 2002 at 15:28:12:

In Reply to: Re: Eliminating dairy from diet posted by Mary on August 26, 2002 at 10:18:29:

The thing is, nobody knows for sure whether we produce and produce enough B12 in our guts. And many symptoms of B12 deficency are masked by another nutrient--folic acid. So in order to be on the safe side, moderate amount of animal product is necessary.

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