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To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms

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To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms

Posted by GG on June 14, 2003 at 00:20:46:

I am little bit confused on exactly what soil organisms are. Are they the same as acidolphilus and bifidus or are they completely different subset of bacteria? Are they even bacteria? Have any of them been scientifically classified and isolated. I've read the label on primal defense and it says the whole food blend in the product is cultured using the following strains.

Lactobacillus Acidophilus
Lactobacillus Bulgaricus
Lactobacillus Plantarum
Lactobacillus Brevis
Lactobacillus Caucasicus
Lactobacillus Fermenti
Lactobacillus Helveticus
Lactobacillus Leichmannii
Lactobacillus Lactis
Lactobacillus Caseii
Bifidobacteria Bifidum
Saccharomyces Boulardii+
Bacillus Subtilis
Bacillus Lichenformis

It also says the product contains 1 billion cfu of HSO's.

Is there a difference between the above list and the 1 billion cfu of HSO's.



Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms

Posted by R. on June 14, 2003 at 01:37:39:

In Reply to: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms posted by GG on June 14, 2003 at 00:20:46:

Soil organisms are organisms that live in soil. Those that are used for medicinal purposes are usually bacteria. We also get them with food unless it's been sterilized. Acidophilus and bifidus are also present in soil, but also in food of plant and animal origin. HSO are a subset of soil organisms that are thought by some to be beneficial to us. Not everybody agrees with it. And Michele's "sources" would say that using SO is unorthodox.

I believe that eating large amounts of veggies that are lacto-fermented with naturally present organisms is superior to taking any probiotic supplement. And cheaper. That is where the supplement manufacture get the organisms! But some people have one or more of the following qualities that makes them feel compelled to buy probiotic supplements: too lazy, ignorant, rich, and gullible. Oh, well, that's what makes the economy work, I guess.

I initially thought, for some reason, that it was Michele who wrote the post, so I prepared an answer that was made especially for her. Custom made, so to speak. But then I noticed that it was GG, and I had to change it. That took all the fun out of it. :(



How are vegetables lactofermented? nmi

Posted by LINDA FFE on June 14, 2003 at 07:06:44:

In Reply to: Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms posted by R. on June 14, 2003 at 01:37:39:

.



Forget it R ,I found ur earlier posting.nmi

Posted by LINDA FFE on June 14, 2003 at 07:31:45:

In Reply to: How are vegetables lactofermented? nmi posted by LINDA FFE on June 14, 2003 at 07:06:44:

.

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Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms

Posted by Sean on June 14, 2003 at 13:08:17:

In Reply to: Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms posted by R. on June 14, 2003 at 01:37:39:

I was going to ask the same question ... about lactofermented veggies ...

ie I know you can buy saurkraut, kemshee, dill pickles
not veggies but yogurt and keifer ...
problem with buying these things is that you have to concern yourself if they heat the product too much or if the other stuff they put in the product is going to ruin the benefits of naturally occuring beneficial organisms.

what veggies do you recommend that can easily be lactofermented? (I missed your previous post if you did talk about that there).

here is a question ... do vegtables have soil organismshealthy organisms in them even if they come from the food store?
and will washing them remove these?

I always wondered this since its advised to wash your veggies especially if you dont buy organic (I think I would need another job if I had to buy all organic food ;) its at least 2x as much money ...

Sean



Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms

Posted by R. on June 14, 2003 at 16:44:39:

In Reply to: Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms posted by Sean on June 14, 2003 at 13:08:17:

I don't buy lacto-fermented veggies for the same reasons you mentioned. In those that pass my quality control are too expensive. For example, Babbies (sp?) cucumbers are said (by the manufacturer) not to be heated (as opposed to its sauerkraut), but the price is significantly higher than it would cost me to make them myself. Considering that it doesn't involve much labor (once you know how to do that), I prefer to make ferment them myself.

Pretty much anything can be fermented, but there seem to be some rules that you'd better follow, at least in the beginning. Cabbage can be lacto-fermented by itself (in its own juice or brine). So can cucumbers. Some of the others (I don't have personal experience with them yet) ferment well in combination with cabbage. Kimchi is such a combination. People add all sorts of things to it (plants, fish, etc.).

do vegetables have healthy soil organisms in them even if they come from the food store?

Yes, food stores are where many people get their veggies to ferment from. Organic veggies are not necessary. Do the best you can. The best you could, I think, would be biodynamically grown produce because it is grown to maximize nutrient content. But if you can't afford them, don't let this stop you from eating veggies (fermented or not) completely.

For starters, I'd like to recommend the following two sources to learn about lacto-fermented foods (plants and other types):
- Fermenting is Fun;
- Making kimchi. If you can't download this file (pdf), then join native-nutrition yahoo group, go to its file section, then you'll see the kimchi file under Recipes-Condiments.
The first source mentions a site maintained by Dom, the famous kefir man. In it, you can find a recipe for so called Revelac. I've read good reports from people using it. But if you are sensitive to yeasts, maybe you should postpone drinking it. Or maybe you could try it to see if it benefits you.

As always, when eating a new food, start gradually.

Follow Ups:


Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms. Better formatting

Posted by R. on June 14, 2003 at 16:45:35:

In Reply to: Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms posted by Sean on June 14, 2003 at 13:08:17:

I don't buy lacto-fermented veggies for the same reasons you mentioned. In those that pass my quality control are too expensive. For example, Babbies (sp?) cucumbers are said (by the manufacturer) not to be heated (as opposed to its sauerkraut), but the price is significantly higher than it would cost me to make them myself. Considering that it doesn't involve much labor (once you know how to do that), I prefer to make ferment them myself.

Pretty much anything can be fermented, but there seem to be some rules that you'd better follow, at least in the beginning. Cabbage can be lacto-fermented by itself (in its own juice or brine). So can cucumbers. Some of the others (I don't have personal experience with them yet) ferment well in combination with cabbage. Kimchi is such a combination. People add all sorts of things to it (plants, fish, etc.).

do vegetables have healthy soil organisms in them even if they come from the food store?

Yes, food stores are where many people get their veggies to ferment from. Organic veggies are not necessary. Do the best you can. The best you could, I think, would be biodynamically grown produce because it is grown to maximize nutrient content. But if you can't afford them, don't let this stop you from eating veggies (fermented or not) completely.

For starters, I'd like to recommend the following two sources to learn about lacto-fermented foods (plants and other types):
- Fermenting is Fun;
- Making kimchi. If you can't download this file (pdf), then join native-nutrition yahoo group, go to its file section, then you'll see the kimchi file under Recipes-Condiments.
The first source mentions a site maintained by Dom, the famous kefir man. In it, you can find a recipe for so called Revelac. I've read good reports from people using it. But if you are sensitive to yeasts, maybe you should postpone drinking it. Or maybe you could try it to see if it benefits you.

As always, when eating a new food, start gradually.

Follow Ups:


Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms (Archive in probiotics.)

Posted by Walt Stoll on June 15, 2003 at 06:26:29:

In Reply to: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms posted by GG on June 14, 2003 at 00:20:46:


NMI

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Re: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms

Posted by Matylda on June 16, 2003 at 19:06:23:

In Reply to: To HY and others re the nature of soil organisms posted by GG on June 14, 2003 at 00:20:46:

Cabbage Rejuvelac:
www.anaturalway.com/rejuvelac.hml
Matylda

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