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I don't know if this is a proper place to post this message--I'm sorry if it's not.
My husband is upset with me because I never want to have sex. We've been married for 5 years, and I find him very attractive...it's just that sex seems like so much work. I'm germaphobic, I hate all the fluids and the smells. The consistency of ejaculate triggers my gag reflex. This is going to sound very selfish but I'd rather just masturbate because it's quick and I get results fast. However, I really want to please my husband and I do enjoy the intimacy that making love generates. Could anyone give me any insights?
By the way, sex is and always has been painful for me. That may be part of it. Doctors all say my insides are OK, I think I just need to start SR to lose some tension. I just can't seem to motivate myself to take time out to relax!
Thank you.
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Hi, I think your husband has the right to be upset. It is important part of the good marriage, there is nothing like true intimacy. Try candles, soft music, flowers, nice perfume, a lot of hugging and kissing and a long, sensuous foreplay, make it enjoyable, not a quickie, just to get it out of the way. That never works. It also shouldn't be painful if your husband is gentle and takes his time.
Luba
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Boy are you lazy!
No wait. That didn't come out right.
You are setting your husband up to have an affair, at the least, or seek the services of an "escort."
I'm not sure I understand.
You LIKE sex (or the memory of it anyway) but you don't like sex with your husband.
It's too messy, and masturbating as opposed to sex with your husband conveys to your husband how much you love him.
Surely he won't feel rejected. And lots of pain but nothing physically wrong.
I hate to say "obviously" but OBVIOUSLY the pain is from not wanting to have sex! Duh!
$64,000 question is what are you going to do about it, if anything? The ball is in your court (no pun intended).
It seems that you have lots of work ahead of you, the main one being your state of mind.
You sound wound real tight, and possibly scared of sex. Was there ever a time when you weren't? Was there ever a time
when you enjoyed sex with someone other than yourself? Was there ever a time when fluids weren't disgusting? Was there
ever a time when you want to share *everything* with your husband? These are the questions you need to be asking yourself.
I fear that your husband is not going to wait forever for you to find the answers to these questions, no matter how
much you think he loves you. You need to have a heart-to-heart with him, but AFTER you have the head to spirit talk
with yourself and answer these questions. If you are still in the same place when you are finished, then I would ask
again if getting married was the right choice for you OR
your husband. A cold, fussy and physically unavailable wife is no man's idea of wedded bliss.
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Have you tried condoms? I hope you come to a happy medium for both of you.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Gregory on October 29, 2003 at 11:48:50:
Hi Gregory,
Thanks for your email. Yes, I know all that. I honestly agree with everything you said (except for the part of liking sex, I only like the lying together afterward feeling close to him)--that's why I'm searching for what to do. I took a self help course online. I have been to a physical therapist to have ultrasound done inside of me to loosen the knots of tension. I have always, always communicated with my husband about it--I've never left him in the cold. We have had many heart-to-hearts. We have sex about once a week...I know he wants it more and I am really trying hard to change. But I do at least "give in" once a week--I just want to give him more than that!
I love him so much and I know I'm not fulfilling his every need. That makes me feel absolutely horrible.
As for these questions:
You sound wound real tight, and possibly scared of sex. Was there ever a time when you weren't? Was there ever a time
when you enjoyed sex with someone other than yourself? Was there ever a time when fluids weren't disgusting? Was there
ever a time when you want to share *everything* with your husband?
The answer is no to every one. I have never liked sex. Not with anyone, at any time. I wish I knew why. I had a very religious upbringing but I don't recall anyone telling me sex was evil. I thought when I got married I would like sex because I wouldn't feel like I was sinning. But I'm still very self conscious and wonder what is acceptable.
I knew I'd get some nasty comments about my email. I'm prepared for that--I know I sound very selfish and odd. But I am searching for help because I truly want to change.
How do I get over the icky fluid thing? Is counselling the only answer?
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 12:40:25:
It sounds like you are not very comfortable with your body and are ashamed of normal body functions. You have to get to know and like your body and get comfortable with all it's functions before you can truly enjoy it. ust don't wait too long or your husband whom you love so much will find somebody who will enjoy sex with him. Maybe you need sex councelling to see why you are so uptight, it does sound like your fear of "sinning" has something to do with it. You have to relax and get romantic, it seems like you are paying too much attention to the physsical part of it instead of making it a truly emmotional experience.
Luba
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Hi Master Bater,
You sound like a nice person who is in a very difficult situation, and smart enough to know you better do something about it fast.
The combination of your germaphobia and religious upbringing have created a difficult obsticle to surmount, but love can melt away many obsticles.
I think since the germaphobia and religious prohibitions are both psychological phenomenons, that's the direction you need to go in. Not that soft music, lighting, flowers and perfume aren't nice, but unless you remove your psychological blocks you'll never get to the place you need to be.
I know it sounds trite to recommend counseling, but in many cases it's the only way to get to the bottom of things. Once you start exploring your feelings and beliefs with a trained professional, and get past the unhealthy ones, you'll begin to open up like a beautiful flower. Yes, it'll be work, but would you rather loose a wonderful life partner and end up alone? I doubt it or you wouldn't be asking for solutions, but you have to do the hard work, it's your life's challange.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 12:40:25:
Hi Master B.
You seem to apparently enjoy sex with yourself, but not with your husband, so that tells me that you enjoy orgasms (good start). I'm wondering WHY you don't enjoy them with your husband.
Was your husband the first and only man you've had sex with, or have there been others? Perhaps you don't have enough experience with men and still feel awkward. This inexperience can be remedied. I'm sure your husband would be more than willing to help with that.
Lastly but importantly, are you attracted to other men, or to no men at all?
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Luba on October 29, 2003 at 12:48:07:
I think you and Philly are definitely right. Yup, I love men and men only. I do love the emotional connection that making love brings but I get so tense during the act! I'm always afraid that it's going to hurt, that I'm going to gag and vomit while performing oral sex, etc. Both have happened and it's embarrassing and hurtful to me and my husband. I'm so attracted to him, I think only of him, so this all drives me crazy! I'm very uncomfortable with my body--he wants me to touch myself when we're having sex and I can't do it. I'm embarrassed that I even masturbate at all.
I think I get so preoccupied with sex that I probably scare any orgasms away...because the only time I've had orgasms is when my husband has worked on me for a very long time, or if I was buzzed or innebriated! But for myself, yeah, it takes probably a minute to reach orgasm.
Maybe I do need counseling...it's just so much easier to talk "faceless" like this than to be sitting in front of someone talking about it!
I really appreciate all of your help.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by On sex on October 29, 2003 at 13:11:42:
Your post was so beautiful and caring, it made me cry. Thank you so much for the advice. You're right, I really do want to change and ultimately will do anything, even embarrassing counseling if that's what it comes to.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 13:38:10:
Hi Master Bater,
Oh thanks so much, that's sweet of you to say, and it feels so nice to be able to help you. I'm glad that you will consider counseling, even if you think it's embarrassing. I bet as you go through it though, you'll learn so much about your self and your life and your family [a jiggsaw puzzle revealed], that you'll be really glad you did it.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 13:31:39:
I wish you all the best!
Luba
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Did you always feel this way about sex? When you were dating him or others?
Why do you want to get results fast?
does he satisfy you? Make you feel dirty?
There are a lot of questions that could help us to help you....
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 13:31:39:
Hi Master B.
You love men. Alright then,I think you're on the right track. I wasn't sure if you had leanings toward women. Hey, it happens! But then, we'd have a different issue on our hands.
You must realize that these fears of "being hurt" and "gagging" can all be eliminated simply by your taking control. Know that you can stop at any time - anytime you feel discomfort.
I'm sure your husband will let you take control, so to speak, and allow you to proceed at your own pace. If not, then is there a control issue between the two of you? Do you not trust him? If he's overbearing and domineering, this could be the reason for your fears.
However, if he's kind and understanding then I can see how rejected and hurt he must feel by this problem. Either way, M.B., I think you can overcome this. Maybe with the next encounter with your husband you will suggest having you take control while he sits back and enjoys. Again, go at your own pace.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by On sex on October 29, 2003 at 13:11:42:
What good advice! I even got a little amorous just reading your reply. I don"t even have ther problem but loved hearing the solution. Thank You. I love this website!
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Your problem is not uncommon. Have you tried doing a Google search for "low sex drive" or "no sex drive," etc.? You might find something that fits your situation.
Also, I would think a visit (both you and hubby) with someone who knows about sexual dysfunction would help. There's possibly more to this than you can figure out by yourself.
Sounds like your heart is in the right place. Just got to get the rest of your body there, too.
Good luck,
Martha
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by PhillyLady on October 29, 2003 at 13:59:32:
Hi again,
He WANTS me to take control, finds that sexy, but I get so darn self conscious! He's very kind and understanding about it all...definitely not overbearing. I am an extremely lucky woman.
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
lubricant until you can learn to relax ( might want to get a book on self-hypnosis).Yellow sesame oil in good.
Make love in the shower with the water running- you won't smell anything
If you aren't morally opposed tpo alcohol, a glass or two of wine can help relax you and scent the room with something you like- your fave perfume or some fresh ground cinnamon or cloves. Put a bit of your fave scent on the skin directly under your nose.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Nita on October 29, 2003 at 14:00:23:
Hi Nita,
That's very nice of you, I'm glad you enjoyed it. That's the beauty of this site, we can all benefit from each others' advice. Sometimes when I have a particular physical ailment and I log on here, like magic, someone is posting about it! Anyway, I'm pretty impressed that I caused you to feel amorous, go out and make a baby or something -- just kidding of course, but have fun.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 14:38:47:
Hi M.B.,
I'm sorry to butt in, and I promise I won't after this because I've already gotten my message across to you, but I just wanted to say that once you start to look inside yourself and start working on things, you'll start to loose your inhibitions, and certain behavior that seems forced now, will come much more naturally. It all starts in your mind and how you feel about yourself. They say the mind is the sexiest part of the body, and I believe it.
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Hi,
It sounds like you have some very deep-rooted fears about sex. Whether this is connected to something that happened in your childhood could be explored through counselling or hypnotherapy. I would definitely recommend the latter as I myself have had some good results behavoiral matters. With me it was bordering on phobia but not to do with sex. I had a "phobia" or phobic reaction whenever someone close to me, I mean immediate family or husband became ill. I once looked at my sister's strep throat, and I can tell you it was bad, and promptly threw up and almost fainted. My problem was deep rooted from my childhood. Im not suggesting you have a phobia about sex, but any kind of problem coming from the mind can be resolved by counselling and/or hypnotherapy. Mine stemmed from my inner insecurity. I suffered extreme anxiety when one of my family became ill - even just flu. I never found out what caused it, but the therapist thought I may have been exposed to some situation when I was a little girl - maybe something connected with my mother having to go into hospital for a while when I was four years old, and I felt insecure. I was not intending to give you my life story, but Im just thinking there may be something that happened to you to cause these deep rooted feelings of repulsion. You will not necessarily remember what it was, if there was something like that. Stress is a major factor, in my opinion, and I agree with other posters who have said SR will help you as well.
I wonder if you deep down feel insecure (maybe without realising it) because you say you love to feel close but you dont want to do the act. You need to be loved and cherished as well to get over this.
I wish you good luck my friend.
Regards,
Maz
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 14:38:47:
Hi M.B.
Your husband sounds very sweet. I can only see his encouraging you as a positive sign of his determination to work through this with you.
You said something about wanting to please him. But have you tried just "using" him to please yourself? It's OK. He won't mind:-)
Is there something you've thought about doing that would please YOU, but were afraid to try because you thought it wouldn't be for his enjoyment, so you felt guilty about trying it? I would think that most husbands wouldn't mind having their wives use their bodies. By the way, there is no such thing as the right way or wrong way. It's whatever way you like that counts.
Also, you might want to consider natural aphrodisiacs.
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
Hi, Master.
Everyone else's suggestions were so great that it would be presumptious of me to try to add more.
However I will say that, with a husband like yours, you both should look into the Kama Sutra or the Tantra of Sex and expand your foreplay skills.
Let us know what you learn and how you do. A competent sex specialist will not just suggest drugs but will give many of the same suggestions you heard here.
Walt
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
M.B.
If I may ask, what is it about fluids that you find "icky" in the first place?
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
I tell you what, Mater bater,t hat when you feel sexy and attractive, you WANT to have sex. that makes me more horny than anything else. if i am having a 'bad hair day', i dont want to have sex or feel sexual.
do you not feel sexy or attractive when he comes onto you? If not do something about it. Wear make up, dress up, perfume, whatever does it for you, and then see how you feel.
and you need to check out why you have pain during intercourse? that would be a huge wet blanket (no pun intended, heh) to anyone being in the mood.
do you have enough foreplay together so you are aroused enough for penetration?
sex is only work (as you put it) when you are not in the mood. figure out why your body and psyche don't want it. sex may not be important to YOU, but I am sure it is damn important your husband. For his sake, do the work to get better if you want to continue in your relationship, before the problem becomes insurmountable.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Gregory on October 30, 2003 at 10:29:42:
I just don't like the goopy texture, the smell, etc. I wish I could understand why that is. If I have to clean up ejaculate, the somewhat stringy, gloppy texture triggers my gag reflex.
I'm really strange and compulsive about textures. Certain papers, fabrics, etc bother me too. I feel like a freak sometime!
(Be nice...you asked...)
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 30, 2003 at 11:13:26:
You didn't specify, but is this feeling only about oral sex?If it is, your not alone...thats whats good about talking about these intimate issues. I have talked to MANY of my friends (ladies/wives) and they don't enjoy giving oral sex. Hey, and some do.....but the point is find some secular friends and talk about all these sexual issues that are bothering you.
There was a time in my life when I never talked about sexual issues with anyone. Finally, I started opening up a councelor, then found some friends who were more open about it. Sometimes I walk with a group of lady friends and we talk about every sexual issue you can imagine. We usually end up joking and laughing about it.
If you decide to go for counceling, you will find a big sense of relief. Its like having a big secret that causes constant pain or shame.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 30, 2003 at 11:13:26:
I wasn't going to go off on you. I seek understanding.
So it seems to be a lack of understanding "design & function" on your part, and a curious kind of association
that you've made -you've assigned a "value" (bad) to fluids that are essentially neutral. As are almost everything when
it comes to you the functions and parts of your body.
When it comes to your husband, do your think to yourself: He's disgusting? No. You love him & are attracted to him
yet he is constructed of those same wet, disgusting organs and fluids as you. Without them, he would be so much dead
meat, as would you.
Now of course the organs of the body, and the fluid medium on which they exist, as well as the chemical that are their
products and by-products are not disgusting. The are marvels of biological engineering. Current technology can't
duplicate the fine microengineering, much less how it operates so effeciently. OK, not always, which is why so
so many are here. And yes, I have an aversion to opening myself up to look upon all that marvelous engineering.
Yet I know about it's operating environment. It has to be wet because mostly it is made of water. I'm sure you've
heard this before: we, along with everything else living on this planet are made mostly of water. Those "icky" fluids
are literally your lifeblood. But somewhere along the line you have sort of transposed a value ("bad") to how the
organs and their output are percieved. Part of that transposition has occured by way of imagining how the
texture would "taste" without making the distinction that you would never have to be put in the position of actually
doing so. It's a form of mental masturbation if you will. You've used the power of your imagination to give a negative value to something that didn't have one, and then
acted on the imagined value as if it were real.
So the "how" has been answered, but not the why. That you would know better than I, but natch, I have a therory that
it actually is your religious upbringing that is the culprit. I think you absorbed the message that the body,
and "desires of the flesh" are wrong, without ever realizing that this is what you were taking in and
assimilating, incorporating it into your psyche and worldview.
How this is done is pretty interesting in its own right (see here), but the problem is how to reverse it. I do believe that hypnotherapy would be of some use, far more than regular counselling in this case.
Often when you change behavior, your rationale changes to accomodate the new behavior, and it becomes a non-issue as
far as long sessions with a shrink are concerned. You may want to go that route, once you decide if you want to
change or not.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by anon on October 30, 2003 at 12:06:16:
Nope, not just oral. If, for example, he ejaculates on me instead of inside me...cleaning that off makes me gag, too. :-(
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Gregory on October 30, 2003 at 12:16:03:
Hi Gregory,
That makes a lot of sense. Thank you for taking so much time to post for me!
I agree that I have a lot of re-programming to do.
Also, I think your "desires of the flesh" statement probably hit the nail on the head. I've never been told sex is dirty or bad (I guess I WAS told once it was bad if it was pre-marital), but I sure do feel that way! Do you think I could do self-hypnosis? Or do you think I'd need to see a professional? I've never researched it before, so I don't know how it all works.
Thanks,
In Reply to: Textures posted by Master B on October 30, 2003 at 14:43:12:
Yes, I think you can do self-hypnosis, but I would go to a professional hypnotist first. That person will be able to
do the preliminary work. I'm betting that you are very shy and do not want anyone else to know about this, but self-
hypnosis may not work without a professional to get you over those first few "speed bumps." Basically I feel that
you essentially will not believe yourself when in a trance state. You will defeat your purpose before even beginning.
Under that circumstance, having someone else start you off is more effective than trying to battle your own disbelief
and work to get to the level of relaxation required for hypnotic trance to be effective. Many people here question
SR and "how they will know when they are in it" and so on, so it is better if someone else can create that environment
for you, allowing you to "concentrate" on relaxing.
When you can reach that level by yourself, then you're ready to effectively do self-hypnosis on your own, and
won't have to battle your psyche and body at the same time. It'll be time to reinforce what the hypnotist has started,
and it won't take that much time either.
In Reply to: Re: Textures (and perceptions) posted by Gregory on October 30, 2003 at 15:06:05:
nmi
In Reply to: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master Bater on October 29, 2003 at 11:15:51:
I was in a 16 year marriage.. after intercourse , withen minutes I would end up gagging and vomiting.. the smell alone would be enough, though it was not significantly odorous, it was not a nice smell to me.. the textures and slime made it all the worse..
We divorced some years ago(partly due to this problem..he got fed up with the gagging and vomiting, he did not feel very manly knowing that even the thought of sex with him made me gag) I loved and I had sexual desire out the wazoo, but try being convincing while puking..
ANYWAY I have had 2 sexual partners in the past 7 years.. and both of them their scent actually was a fabulous turn on.. NO gag at all and even sparked an intense desire in me to perform orally, something that I never would have thought possible based on my past experiences..
I loved(still love) my ex husband, but I guess his feremones are not for me.. I actually associate the violent response to his semen as similiar to an allergic reaction, thank goodness I do not react to all semen this way.
In Reply to: pleasure, gag and puke too( but not with the new lover) posted by his scent turned me green on October 31, 2003 at 05:02:30:
Thanks, His.
I had never heard of this before but, in the light of recent discoveries, it is perfectly understandable. Congratulations for finding a compatible partner. I am sure that there are a lot more of them out there than there are of the metabolic makeup of your first husband.
Walt
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on October 29, 2003 at 13:31:39:
Hi Master B
Have you tried "69"?
That's amazing how quickly YOU can come to enjoy giving your husband oral sex, when you are both being pleasured simultaneously.
You can focus on the pleasur of receiving oral sex from him, and somehow whilst giving it to him at the same time, it's like your brain has less time/attention to think whether you REALLY like it or not, as you are too involved in YOUR OWN pleasure of the moment.
Try it and see if it makes any difference.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Anonymous on November 04, 2003 at 04:01:15:
Double the fun but only half the pleasure. You can't concentrate on your own pleasure if you have to concentrate on giving it too.
She is also likely to have to confront no only her own "icky fluids" but her husband's as well when he cums. She needs to get her 341/2 issues straight before trying something like 69 IMO.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Advanced Course @ Uni on November 04, 2003 at 05:01:51:
That is so not true. you can concentrate on both. But it's not like she is going to be concentrating so intently, like it's a uni degree or something.
I wasn't always that into giving oral, loved to receive, no problem.
But with 69, the pleas ure is so intense when receiving, that giving it to your partner, makes it an extremely erotic, pleasurable experience, both at the same time, particulary when you realize how excited he is from it. So she COULD end up actually enjoying giving oral. she would be able to forget about any "icky" stuff, as she will be too focused on other pleasures to be concerned.
And when he cums, she can back off from that, she doesn't have to go the whole hog IMO!
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by anonymous on November 04, 2003 at 05:20:11:
We could debate endlessly. In the end it is her for her to decide what she is going to do, and how she is going to do it. Sarah, I wish you the best of luck, no matter what you decide.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Advanced Course @ Uni on November 04, 2003 at 05:01:51:
Unfortunately, this is correct for me
"You can't concentrate on your own pleasure if you have to concentrate on giving it too."
Tried it, but didn't feel like I could perform because I was so distracted. Also, you start getting excited, you start breathing heavier...how do you perform oral sex while you're trying to take deep breaths? It was all rather overwhelming. I would rather just concentrate on pleasing my mate, I think.
Thanks, though.
In Reply to: Re: For anyone...about sex.... posted by Master B on November 04, 2003 at 19:40:28:
Hmpf! That's too bad.
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