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Hi Dr Stoll,
There was a post recently about whether hypnosis tapes will achieve the required brain waves necessary to have the same effect as meditation in SR. I also wanted to know more about this and did a little research, including the archives here.
As we all know by now, there are four levels of brain activity experienced by humans. These are beta, alpha, theta and delta. From the website www.altered-state.com/sub/believe.htm I understand that the necessary brain waves do indeed occur in hypnosis, alongside meditation AND normal sleep patterns. I give below what the descriptions said:
Beta - Full consciousness
Alpha - Falling asleep
Awakening in the morning
Hypnosis
Meditation
Theta - Early stages of sleep
Deep hypnosis
Deep meditation
Delta - Full sleep to deepest sleep
Apparently, for most people hypnosis is in the mid-alpha range of activity, whilst remaining fully aware of what is going on, but deeply relaxed. However, even more beneficial, seems to be the theta stage when much more can be achieved.
I seem to remember Walt saying that sleep does not provide anything like the benefits that meditation provides in so far as the hypothalamus is concerned. Could this be because when we go to sleep we pass through the alpha and theta stages fairly quickly? I don't know. Having said that, I did read once that our sleep pattern is such that we go from one stage to another several times throughout the night. This being the case, would we not get enough alpha and theta during sleep in one night to allow the hypothalamus to release the stored stress?
It could be that people with stored stress do not get the right kind of sleep for the necessary release to occur. Maybe this is the reason why meditation is better than sleep, but to my mind there is no reason why hypnosis will not achieve the same effect. BUT, if you only need about 20 minutes twice a day of the alpha/theta, would we not get this small amount with a normal nights sleep?
Trying to get to the bottom of it all.
Regards,
Maz
In Reply to: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? posted by Maz on April 16, 2003 at 03:11:09:
Hi, Maz.
Quality thinking. Keep it up and you will become a master.
There is something different about hypnosis than all the other SRs but it still will produce the effects we are looking for if practiced regularly.
Your musings about sleep are correct. However, if those were effective at reversing stress at a high rate no one would have to practice SR. Remember that SR, practiced close to sleep time, does not produce the long term benefits we are talking about.
Hope this helps.
Walt
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by Walt Stoll on April 17, 2003 at 06:12:20:
If you do SR before bed, why doesnt it give you the benefits? You are still putting yourself in the correct brain modes arent you?
Also - is there any benefit to listening to the brainsyc cds while alseep? does the sound waves add to the brain refreshment gained from sleep?
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by Walt Stoll on April 17, 2003 at 06:12:20:
Thanks Walt. Very helpful.
Regards,
Maz
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by mmreed on April 17, 2003 at 06:51:29:
Hi mmreed,
This point is stated in the archives, as I remember coming across it during my research. I'm sorry I can't pinpoint it but if you scroll through I'm sure you will find it.
Regards,
Maz
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by Maz on April 17, 2003 at 07:37:51:
Hi mmreed,
If you find it, will you please e-mail me the information so I can include it in the book?
Thanks,
Happygal
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by Happygal on April 17, 2003 at 09:05:09:
what book???? are you writting a book on SR?
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by mmreed on April 17, 2003 at 06:51:29:
is there any benefit to listening to the brainsyc cds while alseep? does the sound waves add to the brain refreshment gained from sleep?
I think that is not a good idea as those sounds would interfere with natural sleep cycles.
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by mmreed on April 17, 2003 at 16:11:16:
Hi mmreed,
Walt and I are writing a book about the 3LS.
Best wishes,
Happygal
In Reply to: Re: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? Archive. posted by mmreed on April 17, 2003 at 06:51:29:
Hi, MMRead.
You DO get short term benefits but you are asleep so you do not notice them. It is known, empiricaly, that the long term benefits (which are the main reason for doing it) do not accumulate if one goes to sleep during or right after the practice.
To your last question: I have no experience.
Walt
In Reply to: SR - Hypnosis v Meditation v Sleep - Dr Stoll and anyone? posted by Maz on April 16, 2003 at 03:11:09:
Perhaps one of the "problems" with Centerpointe is that it puts you into Delta with a signal that keeps part of your
mind awake. Your body goes to sleep, and you want to follow it but you're awake. This is probably why so many people zone
out. I used to program my L/S machine for just this effect. It was facinating to see just how deep I could go before
dropping off to sleep.
Centerpointe is much better at it, and the benefits are much
more tangible. To be able to see the actual changes taking
place for affirmations, and to often feel the stress melting away is priceless. It doesn't happen every session, but when
it does there is no mistaking it for anything else. CP even
enhances sleep, so for that reason alone I would recommend
meditation.
A fair amount of psychological issues resolves themselves in meditation, possibly because you keep calming your mind.
Those issues don't have to keep clamoring for your attention and in the same manner, sleep can become more restful and
less fitful. Your body can do repairs more efficiently.
I don't know that hypnosis has any of these effects, although you could probably argue that the Centerpointe
affirmations are self-hypnosis. I am a bit skeptical that hypnosis by another person is as effective (or even
possible) but then I don't respond well to "outside hypnosis" anyway.
The kinds of brainwave patterns you seek -the Alpha/Theta dip in the pool may indeed occur during sleep (several times
actually) but you have to be awake to register the benefit so the only thing to be concerned about is what will get
you there quickest or what will train you the fastest to be able to do it yourself. After you can do it yourself, you no longer have to worry about this method vs.
that one, sleep, hypnosis, or which CD to buy.
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