|
[ Supplements Archive ] [ Main Archives Page ] [ Glossary/Index ] [ FAQ ] [ Recommended Books ] [ Bulletin Board ] |
Search this site! | |
I notice on www.mercola.com he says we should strive to get our nutrients from our food and not rely on supplements which are just a band-aid.
Maybe this new law might be doing us all a favour?
In Reply to: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without posted by maybe on August 01, 2003 at 05:30:31:
Here's why: You have to look at why supplements are necessary in the first place. It is because the food provided in markets are deficient in the nutrients and vitamins meant to sustain you.
And THAT is due to poor farming practices the most important of which is crop rotation and soil management. So the crops are grown without the life promoting vitiamins and minerals. So supplements, but they really shouldn't be called supplements at all, because at this point they aren't supplement so much as they are direct replacement for what is missing.
Now if you take supplements off the market, it isn't going to suddenly make the quality of grown foods better. Nosiree. What is goin gto happen is that many more people will succumb to various degerative diseases.
Initailly I had hoped that exactly what Mercola had hoped would happen, would really happen, but I have to face the facts. Farmers seem clueless when it comes to raising healthy, nutrition-laden foods. They eagerly spray all manner of pesticides and weed killers on the crops, spray wax on the crops to color it, Tamper with the milk, tamper with the living processes of the livestock. Exactly where does Mercola think all this healthy food is going to come from?
I'm sure he hasn't been to the health food store lately and checked out the prices. He a doctor so maybe he didn't bat an eye, but real food cost real money. His fancy ostrich and bison steaks are not the answer either. And neither is raising your own crops, even assuming it if feasible (which of course it isn't).
This law is not doing anyone a favor except for pharmaceutical companies, and people gullible enough to think a huge loss is really a small gain.
In Reply to: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without WELL Mercola is WRONG! posted by Gregory on August 01, 2003 at 07:00:50:
Thanks Gregory. I agree. Except, why is it pointless to grow your own crops? I grow my own lettuces and tomatoes. They are completely organically grown and what could be fresher than just 5 minutes ago picked from the garden?
Next year I plan to improve (as I had a couple of disasters) when I get the hand of things, grow other veg too. Why is this not feasible? Do you mean from the point of view that not every has a garden or people have to work 9-5 and don't have the time. That I do agree with.
There is one other thing which I do agree with Mercola. You can never hope to replace what you get from food with a supplement, simply because we do not know what the food gives to us that we need. We only think we do!
Regards,
Maz
In Reply to: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without posted by maybe on August 01, 2003 at 05:30:31:
Maybe, Mercola is " living in a tree " or a bubble..I pay little attention to his comments..Steve
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without posted by Steve on August 01, 2003 at 07:56:22:
I thought he was a respected doc. I have seen lots of articles posted on this site from mercola and really thought he was a 'good guy'. Of course there is always the chance he is just making money somehow out of this, just like anyone else. Why do you think he's not to be listened to?
In Reply to: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without posted by maybe on August 01, 2003 at 05:30:31:
mercola offers supplements on his website and posts numerous reviews of studies on their effectiveness. he likes to focus on the superiority of organic foods but he doesn't say that supplements are without value. i think you've taken him out of context a bit.
As for attempts through the legislature to weaken DSHEA, ask yourself if you want to have a CHOICE or do you want to pay prescription prices for your next bottle of vitamin E? assuming you would be given access to it even then.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without WELL Mercola is WRONG! posted by Maz on August 01, 2003 at 07:20:48:
Your last line makes a good point. Science can not duplicate the extemre intricacies of the nutritional compounds in foods. It would seem that supplementing with a whole food product is the best bet for most indviduals.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without WELL Mercola is WRONG! posted by Maz on August 01, 2003 at 07:20:48:
Well not everyone has a backyard and a green thumb to set it to rights properly. And yes, a nine to five does cut in on becoming Mr. Greenjeans.
There is even the problem of obtaining whole foods, should all of the above be too much of an obstacle. All that is left is supplementation. It is may be a poor substitute, but the alternative is even worse.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without posted by maybe on August 01, 2003 at 08:16:45:
Maybe, He seems to be stuck on his " No Grain Diet "..I receive his news letter and yes he's trying to sell his products..That's ok but not for me..Steve
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without WELL Mercola is WRONG! posted by GG on August 01, 2003 at 13:26:35:
Maz, It's simple..Do you feel better taking supplements or doing without? This " old dude " will keep poping the supps..Steve
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without WELL Mercola is WRONG! posted by Steve on August 01, 2003 at 15:26:53:
Steve, I have to say NO mostly. I take magnesium because it clears up my leg cramps and I take Vit B complex because I have suffered with anxiety in the past. I take CoE10 because its a good antioxidant. I take fish oils because I never eat fish. I take a multi to be on the safe side. But I have to say I'm not really sure all this is doing me any good. The magnesium definitely is and I think the Vit B is too. We know so little!
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without WELL Mercola is WRONG! posted by Maz on August 01, 2003 at 15:59:31:
if the quality of your supplements is good, it IS helping because these are the raw materials your body needs to function.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without WELL Mercola is WRONG! posted by Maz on August 01, 2003 at 15:59:31:
Maz, How can you say no when magnesium clears up your leg cramps..What food only can you eat that does that? Go off it for 2 weeks and see if they return..Steve
In Reply to: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without posted by maybe on August 01, 2003 at 05:30:31:
Regardless of what Mercola (or anyone) says, there IS one problem with supplements, namely, they are almost all processed. I don't know HOW these processing processes take place, but nowadays anything that's processed seems like bad news. So, IMO, the most trustworthy way to dietery health is still eating organic, whole, fresh, unprocessed, unadulterated foods.
About the magnesium issue raised by Maz and Steve, well, plant foods are extremely rich in this mineral, especially in their seeds. A diet based on plants easily provides more than enough high quality magnesium one needs everyday. Plus, you also get all the coenzymes that help with the absorbtion and utilization. So I don't understand why most people still cling to their supplements so much. Must be some sort of psychological reasons involved.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 02, 2003 at 17:29:05:
i would agree with you bing, except for one thing. In 1945, the USDA stated that a cup of spinach contained something like 98mg of iron. Just 50yrs later, we find out that American-grown spinach contains just 2-3mg of iron per cup. whether organically grown foods will compensate for this completely, i don't know but its doubtful. there are many factors of modern life destroying the nutrient value in the food chain and even the organic growers can't control all of them.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 02, 2003 at 17:29:05:
What would one have to consume, food wise, to get 3 grams of vitamin C per day?
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by ~CT on August 03, 2003 at 00:02:36:
45 average oranges contain that much.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by ~CT on August 03, 2003 at 00:02:36:
One would have to eat 44 florida oranges or 46 red chili peppers (According to the USDA nutrient database).
Personally I would go for the peppers just to see if I survive.
After reading about the difference in Vitamin C and Ascorbic acid, I'm wondering if the majority of scientific research has been done using ascorbic acid instead of vitamin C from foods. If so, we may need less vitamin C than ascorbic acid - or worse, the 2 may perform completely different functions entirely.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by peterb on August 02, 2003 at 20:50:28:
Just about every study in this matter shows that organically grown foods contain more nutrients than the chemically grown types.
Also, organic produce doesn't necessarily cost more. A 5 lbs bag of organic carrots costs from $2.99 to $3.99, depending on the store. A large bunch of greens is about $ 1.00 (or no more than $2.00). If one shops wisely and avoid buying processed foods, organic foods can be quite cheap--at least that's my experience.
As to the iron content in spinach 50 years ago, well, I remember reading about a misplaced point that made the iron content appear 10 times more that it really was. Don't know if it's true or not.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by ~CT on August 03, 2003 at 00:02:36:
For a healthy person, does one really need that much V-C?
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by peterb on August 03, 2003 at 09:48:37:
That sounds like an overdose! :) I certainly don't want THAT much V-C in one day.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by thessa on August 03, 2003 at 09:50:29:
Good point, thessa. I think the nutrients in fresh, organic foods are best utilized by the body. That's how our ancesters got their nutrients anyway.
Supplements are best used to mend a severe deficiency, like a drug. Otherwise, it's best to get our nutrients from foods--organically grown, that is.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by thessa on August 03, 2003 at 09:50:29:
and I don't need ALL the details regarding elimination after ingesting all of the peppers, however it may be safe to say that you will be a bit shaky in the legs after the experience, should you try it :grin:
I think I'll stick with my mineral based ascorbate supplement for now.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 10:56:06:
I don't think I could consume all of the food necessary to provide my body with the vitamins/minerals it seems to need.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 10:27:14:
Well, here in the midwest it (organic) costs a considerable amount more than the regular grocery stores.
Add up the price of extras (organic) that most cooks have on hand like dried onions and various spices, lemon juice, etc. and then lunch stuff for kids like peanut butter (almond butter is $13.50 per small jar)and jelly. It costs a LOT more to buy organic for our house.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 10:27:14:
Well, here in the midwest it (organic) costs a considerable amount more than the regular grocery stores.
Add up the price of extras (organic) that most cooks have on hand like dried onions and various spices, lemon juice, etc. and then lunch stuff for kids like peanut butter (almond butter is $13.50 per small jar)and jelly. It costs a LOT more to buy organic for our house.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 10:40:02:
then, compared to almost all life on this planet, you'll be deficient. we lost the ability to make ascorbic acid many thousands of years ago, now only supplements will compensate.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 10:27:14:
this is, of course, why i eat organic foods. however, "more" nutrient content doesn't mean "optimal" nutrient content. the food chain is damaged, organic growers use contaminated water to irrigate their crops, and they cannot control the quality of air affecting agriculture. i've never seen a retraction or critique about a "bad" number representing these 50yr old measurements. unfortunately, the dramatic downturn in nutrient content is effecting ALL our food, planet-wide. i remind you that huge population studies have proven the benefits of supplementation over time, mainly with the use of vitamins C and E, showing reductions in death by as much as 50% by ANY cause for many thousands of people.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by ~CT on August 03, 2003 at 13:01:25:
I did mention that PROCESSED foods cost more. If I were you, I'd make my own organic peanut/almond butter and jelly for the kids.
btw, it's a LOT healthier to not buy any processed food but to process your own. That way, one is able to get all the nutrients one needs from whole foods alone, without having to rely on supplements.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by peterb on August 03, 2003 at 16:48:26:
Well, peterb, in my country, hardly anyone takes supplements, yet they seem to have better health than the Americans (on the average). So I really don't know how effective supplements are...except that it's a western concept that sounds extremely alienated from nature to my eastern ears :)
To me, human health is closely connected to the health of our planet. As far as agriculture is concerned, organic farming seems the only plausible way to go to save the earth from being turned into a even more toxic dump. And, there is a lot more to human health and longevity than supplements. JMHO
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:05:11:
Well, no you wouldn't. You would be me, and this me doesn't have as much extra time as you seem to have.
The point is (was) that it is not inexpensive to buy organic.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by peterb on August 03, 2003 at 16:26:27:
Really? I thought many fruits and vegetables contain this nutrient in its natural form. In fact, several fruits are extremely rich in ascorbic adcid...
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by ~CT on August 03, 2003 at 12:51:48:
Actually, it's pretty easy to obtain all the nutrients from whole foods. That's what I've been doing since 1995 and so far so good.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by ~CT on August 03, 2003 at 19:23:22:
Um, right. I would choose not to have kids at all. that surely saves a lot of time and money, doesn't it? lol
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:34:45:
Well, not really bing.
Organics in my neck of the woods is very expensive too. I've been down to visit Dad in Florida, and the Whole Foods market is as expensive there as it is here. He's only buying for one (or two if I'm there) and those bills average about $100 per person.
I'm not sure where you are getting your organics from (beyond growing what you need), and again, not everyone has the time, land, or skill to do this bing. Those of us who don't, buy from the market and it ain't cheap.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:17:19:
bing, i agree with everything you just said. it may be that americans NEED more nutrients because their refined diets are pushing them into deficient states. in addition, we have far more chemical exposure here than in your homeland. so, I wouldn't pretend to compare these different populations so directly. actually, you touch on something else that I find interesting. The western concept for using supplements to address disease states certainly includes the use of herbals to restore balance and reverse disease. How is that so different than methods used by your ancestors and their progeny?
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:27:23:
yes, but your ancestors were making around 10g every day, and you can only put a dent in that by eating fruit, yet my sense is that you believe we are in a natural state internally and only need to do the right things EXternally. if your mind fully accepts that idea, it can work for you.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:27:23:
I am sure I recall Walt saying that fruit nowadays is full of sugar, and barely has any nutritional value.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:29:48:
nmi
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:34:45:
"The point is (was) that it is not inexpensive to buy organic.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 19:34:45:
um, thanks for not breeding, bing...lol ;-)
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by Lorem Ipsum on August 04, 2003 at 01:18:09:
lol! funny!
so you dont want to have kids bing, because organic food costs too much. ok then. :)
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 03, 2003 at 10:29:31:
Hi, Bing.
The new optimal nutrient guide says that the average human, in this culture, needs about 5000 milligrams of vitamin C daily for optimum health. The old RDAs only listed the amounts needed of anything to prevent serious disease or death---a far cry from optimum health.
Walt
In Reply to: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without-- Archive. posted by Walt Stoll on August 04, 2003 at 07:11:44:
but does 5000mg intefere with other supplements at all? & should it always be took with food?
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by peterb on August 03, 2003 at 21:46:50:
heh heh yea, the power of the mind!
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by peterb on August 03, 2003 at 21:39:58:
Well, it seems to me the only difference is that the Chinese use herbal remedies to cure a disease. For people with average health, they believe the herbal remedies (or anything else other than food) will produce an imbalance and eventually lead to ill health. So they are very cautious about ingesting herbs/medicine when they are not sick. Even when they suffer mild diseases, most people tend to use food to bring back health.
There is a saying there: when healthy people eat herbal remedies for a while, they'll become sick.
In Reply to: the point, again, since you seem to have missed it posted by ~CT on August 03, 2003 at 22:38:54:
CT and Gregory:
There is no doubt that on average organic foods cost more than conventionally grown ones--that's an obvious fact that I I better to argue with. What I have been saying is that if one shops wisely, organic foods don't necessarily cost more. For instance, if one avoids processed items and stick to the basic, bulk type, one doesn't pay more than regular grocery store items: such as bulk grains, bulk beans, bulk nuts and seeds, fresh greens, carrots, garlic/green onions/ginger etc. These are the things I get regularly from Whole Foods Market and the price I pay is quite comparable to other supermarkets.
I also realize that I, like many other Chinese here, seem to need/eat different food items from the Americans. So it's very likely that what I like to eat happens to be the more basic and thus less expensive foods...
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by rewolf on August 04, 2003 at 03:29:30:
yep. you got it. ;)
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by bing on August 04, 2003 at 13:00:01:
thanks for that insight.
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by Bliss on August 03, 2003 at 21:49:25:
you're right, too much fruit = too much sugar = too much insulin. Even so, that would be better than the typical American REFINED sugar intake of some 150lbs a year!
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without-- Archive. posted by WENDY on August 04, 2003 at 07:55:23:
Hi, Wendy.
I do not think it makes any difference.
Walt
In Reply to: Re: Supplements - Mercola says we should do without--problems with supplements.. posted by Bliss on August 03, 2003 at 21:49:25:
It really depends on which fruit. Lemmon and lime contain very little sugar but considerable amount of V-C, especially the organically grown ones.
|
[ Supplements Archive ] [ Main Archives Page ] [ Glossary/Index ] [ FAQ ] [ Recommended Books ] [ Bulletin Board ] |
Search this site! | |