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I am concerned about some information given off this BB to a poster about ginger having Hot energy and ulcers supposedly being a Hot condition in all cases; thus, ginger being contraindicated for all ulcers. I want to stress again that Western-defined medical conditions and TCM syndromes seldom correspond. They rarely do. If memory serves, there are 6 possible underlying TCM Roots in cases of ulcers.
Part of the confusion is due to not understanding how Cold and infections can act in the body. In TCM there are two main theories for understanding febrile (feverish) conditions. In many cases (though not all) these correspond some to bacterial and viral infections. The two theories are Cold-Induced Evils and Virulent Heat Evils.
The Cold-induced Evils is the earlier of the two theories. The Virulent Heat Evils theory was developed after China began to have increased contact with other countries and began to be devastated by new Evils which did not follow and could not be successfully treated by the older Cold-induced Evil model. If the Protective Qi is strong enough, a person can avoid infections which fall under the Cold-induced Evils category (like the common cold, mononucleosis, etc.). In Virulent Heat Evils, the pathogen is so strong that it can overwhelm the strongest protective Qi. Many cases of meningitis are Virulent Heat Evils.
There are 6 stages in Cold-induced Evils. The first 3 are characterized by fever, and the fever can be especially high in the Yang Ming (Bright Yang) stage. When it comes to infectious, febrile illnesses, just because Heat is present, this does not mean that Cold is not a factor in the development of the fever and infection. I know this is confusing, but I wanted to stress that infection does not always rule out Cold involvement in TCM. In many cases ulcers are caused by a bacterial infection.
The 6 stages of Cold-induced Evils does explain what is sometimes seen in cases of recurring and chronic mononucleosis and in some cases of CFIDS which started with a viral infection. One thing that is particularly puzzling to Western doctors in the case of these two medical condition is that some patients will have a constant low-grade fever whereas others have a constant below normal body temperature. Because of this, some doctors believe that they're looking at different illnesses in both cases. They're not. They're looking at different stages of the same condition in both cases.
When it comes to the 6 stages of Cold-induced Evils, the progression of the disease isn't always straight through. Stages can be skipped or gone through quickly or backed up through. In some cases a person may become stuck in a particular stage. It's the first 3 stages, the Yang stages, of Cold-induced illnesses which are characterized by fever. The latter 3, the Yin stages often are characterized by feeling cold and having a below normal body temperature. You're not looking at different illnesses between those with constant low grade fever and those with below normal body temperatures. You're looking at different stages of the same illness.
The treatments for the 6 stages and even substages of the 6 stages are different. What helps in one stage may make a person sicker in a different stage. In some cases, inappropriate treatment in one stage can bring on a more serious stage. For example, using too many cooling herbs or antibiotics (which have cooling energy) in the Yang Ming stage can in some cases trigger the more serious Tai Yin (Greater Yin) stage in which the person starts to feel cold a lot and have trouble warming up.
According to TCM, many of the cases where people have a constant low-grade fever or constantly have a below normal body temperature are cases where the person has become stuck in a certain phase of Cold-induced Evil. The Evil has never been cleared completely. If it had been, the person would not be stuck. (Note: One way you differentiate if this is possibly a case of Cold-induced Evil not resolved or simple Yang or Yin Deficiency is by the history of the person. Does the person report that his/her problems started with an infection that never really went away or things have now been the same since? If so, this points very strongly to an unresolved Cold-induced Evil.
Alternating between fever and chills points very strongly to a person being stuck in the Shao Yang (Lesser Yang) stage.
Judy
In Reply to: Infections & TCM posted by Judy on July 23, 2001 at 00:02:06:
Judy,
After reading several posts that you have made, I have to tell you that I am blown away by your knowledge of TCM!!! I know NOTHING about it, but have just recently become fascinated by it. It seems so complex!!! How long have you studied it? Are you Certified/licensed in it? Gosh, I am just getting a handle on herbs and their functions and latin names.
You awe me... not many people do that. Since you are the guru that you are... I have a question for you...
The website I have posted below sells a product for getting rid of acne and it is based on TCM. I linked you to the ingredients page to see if this stuff would work. Do you mind viewing the page and replying back as to whether I should order the stuff or save my money.
My acne consists of a few red, painful cysts in the hollow under my cheekbone and jawline, a few little whiteheads, clogged pores on my forehead, nose and chin (where oil production is highest, of course) and a constant pink flush to my face. I just want to know if these pills could help. I already do SR and eat a pretty wholesome diet. Also, if these pills could help... how long would it take to feasibly see results?
I so appreciate you sharing your expertise with me!
Thank you,
Ali
In Reply to: Re: Infections & TCM posted by Ali on July 23, 2001 at 05:36:08:
I have some concerns about this product because it's a shotgun approach from a TCM perspective with some naturopathy thrown in.
The link below is to a much better article on TCM and acne. It goes into the main TCM Roots that can manifest as acne: Lung Heat, Stomach Heat, Toxic Heat, Damp Heat, and Blood Heat.
Heat is the main Pernicious Evil in acne. When the article talks about clearing Heat from the apropriate meridian or Zang Fu Organ, it's talking about the Lung or Stomach. When it talks about Fundamental Substance, it's talking about Blood Heat.
The article gives some criteria for determining which is the Root and then gives possible treatments for the appropriate Root. TCM is concerned with identifying and treating Roots. Using a shotgun approach can be dangerous. Let's say for example that a person does have Heat in the Lungs but has some major Cold problems overall in the body. Using a shotgun formula like this could aggravate the Cold in the rest of the body because of the shotgun approach. It could even trigger Damp Heat problems whereas before there were none because the Spleen is vulnerable to Cold. When the Spleen is Deficient, Dampness accumulation can result, and if some other factors are present, this Dampness can become Damp Heat.
I also have some concerns over the use of the word cholesterol in the article. Cholesterol is NOT a TCM concept. The TCM concept is that a diet with too many greasy foods or spicey foods (or cold or raw foods) can damage the Spleen, and this can result in Dampness problems (and poor digestion). I'm automatically concerned when any article makes cholesterol out to be totally bad and only a villain. Health problems can arise from or be linked to a person having too little cholesterol as well as too much.
My suggestion is to read the criteria for the different possible main Roots, and determine which sounds more like what you have. Then, do some more research. More than one may be present. I'll be glad to provide a little more detail on the particular syndrome(s), or you may be able to locate more in-depth info on each on the Internet. Personally, I'm particularly fond of Advance Search on Google for finding info.
I'm not practicing; I'm still learning. I'm definitely not a guru, just someone who got (and continues to get) a lot of help from TCM after 20+ years of being told by Western allopathic medicine "It's all in your head, I'm unfamiliar with this, Nothing can be done," etc.
TCM is going to sound complex and seem overwhelming to just about anyone who was not raised in a TCM culture. For one thing the underlying concepts are so different from Western allopathic medicine. For another, there is the Chinese fondness for choosing names for syndromes which are both very literal and very poetic at the same time. Names like "Kidneys Refusing to Grasp Qi" (factor in some not all cases of asthma, a variation of Kidney Yang Deficiency), Liver Fire Blazing", Painful Obstructive Syndrome (most cases of arthritis and rheumatism), etc.
TCM actually is not all that complicated once a person gets over the culture shock and becomes familiar with the basics. It's a very logical and holistic system with an emphasis on the practical and what works.
You may also want to check the general encyclopedia over on healingpeople.com for acne. It doesn't have any TCM info but does have some other info.
Blue Poppy Press may also have something on acne and TCM. BPP puts out so many books it's hard to remember all of them.
Be sure to check the naturopathy section in the link provided. You'll see some of the herbs listed in this formula listed in this section.
Judy
In Reply to: Infections & TCM posted by Judy on July 23, 2001 at 00:02:06:
Thanks, Judy!
Namaste`
Walt
In Reply to: Acne & TCM posted by Judy on July 23, 2001 at 09:15:25:
NMI
In Reply to: Acne & TCM posted by Judy on July 23, 2001 at 09:15:25:
Thanks Judy!!! :-) You have been immensely helpful!
Ali
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